Dominique Crenn Transcript
Kerry Diamond:
Hi, everyone. You are listening to Radio Cherry Bombe and I'm your host, Kerry Diamond, coming to you from Newsstand Studios at Rockefeller Center in the heart of New York City.
Happy holidays. I have a little present for you today. It's my conversation with Chef Dominique Crenn, live from Jubilee Wine Country this past October. If you follow Cherry Bombe, you know how much we love Dominique, one of the most celebrated chefs in the country, and one of the most important female chefs in the whole world. She's the force behind Atelier Crenn restaurant in San Francisco. And she's an author, humanitarian, breast cancer survivor, and absolute life force. She was also the cover star of Cherry Bombe's Paris issue earlier this year. Jubilee Wine Country weekend was hosted by Cherry Bombe at the Solage Napa Valley Resort in Calistoga, California, and it was an incredible weekend. Brilliant women, amazing wine, and some of the most beautiful weather and sunsets ever. It's always a pleasure interviewing Dominique, and I learn more about her every time. She even had her own cheering section in the audience, her wife, the award-winning actor and director Maria Bello, and their tiny Chihuahua, Lulu.
A lot of you are in a reflective mood as we approach 2025, so I'm happy to share the Jubilee Wine Country recordings with you. Earlier this week, we dropped my interview with Robin McBride, and we'll be sharing more. I hope hearing from these accomplished folks helps you as you think about the new year ahead and what you hope to achieve personally and professionally. Thank you to the sponsors of Jubilee Wine Country, Kerrygold, San Pellegrino, California Grown, California Walnuts, and California Prunes. And thank you to all the wine country winemakers we had the privilege of meeting and working with.
If you'd like to attend Jubilee next year, our big Jubilee conference is taking place in New York City on Saturday, April 12th. We have a new location, the Glasshouse, right across from the Hudson River, and it is going to be our biggest and best Jubilee yet. You can purchase your early bird tickets now before prices go up January 1st. Visit cherrybombe.com for tickets and more information. If you are a Bombesquad member, be sure to check your inbox for a link to special member pricing.
Enjoy my interview with Dominique Crenn. Chef, it's so good to see you.
Dominique Crenn:
Good to see you.
Kerry Diamond:
I don't think I've seen you since our cover shoot, which was one of the most fun covers you've ever done.
Dominique Crenn:
Oh, you were at Atelier. Did you go to it?
Kerry Diamond:
Was that after?
Dominique Crenn:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
That was after. Okay. Take it back. I did see you after that. I got to have a beautiful meal at Atelier Crenn with some of our friends. But thank you for being here today.
Dominique Crenn:
My pleasure.
Kerry Diamond:
I know everyone's so excited to hear from you. I wanted to start with your connection to California because people might be surprised to hear this, but you are not a native Californian.
Dominique Crenn:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us how you wound up here.
Dominique Crenn:
Yes. Well, hello everyone. How's everyone doing? Okay, great. I was born and raised in France. I was born in Versailles, was in an orphanage until the age of, I don't know, 18 months, which is not old. I've spent most of my life outside of Paris and going to Paris to school. I study economy, international business. I wanted to become a photographer, but obviously l'école Lumière didn't accept my credential. And I talked to my dad, "I want to go to California and I want to be like “Starsky and Hutch.”" Like the-
Kerry Diamond:
Some of you might not know what that means. “Starsky and Hutch,” the TV show. We have “Starsky and Hutch” to thank for the fact that Dominique Crenn now lives in California.
Dominique Crenn:
And so, I came here and I literally fell in love with San Francisco. I felt freedom, I felt creativity, I felt curiosity, and I'm like, "This is my home." And then, I was just doing thing around. And I'm like, "I have to go to work." I'm like, "Well, I'm French. I know how to cook."
Kerry Diamond:
I want to go back one step, though. When you flew here, your plane landed, and before you even got off the plane, you had a feeling-
Dominique Crenn:
Yes, I felt it. I felt it in my heart. And I was like, "What's going on?" It's like no one is in front of me. I was like, "What's happening?" And I think it's just a feeling.
Kerry Diamond:
You had never even stepped foot on Californian ground and you felt that?
Dominique Crenn:
I mean, I've been to L.A. before and I didn't like it at the first. I love it now. We have a home out there, so I love it. But yes. And then, I'm like, "I'm just going to feel it, and be free, and no one judges me." And I didn't speak any English. So, I was like, "I think my English is better now." But it was amazing. And I knew at that moment, that I'm like, "Okay, now it's up to me to become who I want to become."
Kerry Diamond:
So, your culinary experience at that point was making sandwiches at a country club in suburban France, right?
Dominique Crenn:
Yes. Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
That's it, if you can imagine that.
Dominique Crenn:
Well, I had to make some money. And I make the best sandwiches, by the way.
Kerry Diamond:
No doubt. So, you're in California, like you said, you need a job. What do you?
Dominique Crenn:
So, I do a lot of research. I came across Jeremiah Tower, if you guys don't know him. But he opened Chez Panisse with Alice Waters. And we love Alice Waters, but Jeremiah was the one who was cooking actually at Chez Panisse.
Then, he was opening Stars. I mean, Stars was already open and everybody was talking about him. What I find out about him is he was not trained. He study architecture and he just become a chef, just automatically. And I'm like, "Well, okay. So, if I can do it, maybe I can."
Kerry Diamond:
But this is one of the buzziest restaurants in America at the time.
Dominique Crenn:
Yes. Open kitchen, 600 covers a night. I walk into the kitchen, and I see this man in white. And it's beautiful, just gorgeous. Just looking at the kitchen. So, I just walk up to him and I say, "Hello, my name is Dominique Crenn. I would like to speak to you." And he's like totally dismiss me. And then, I was just like, "Knock, knock. I'm Dominique Crenn and I would like to talk to you, if I can be able to work under you." And he's just like, "You know what? I'm sorry, but it's like you don't have any appointment and whatever." "I'm Dominique Crenn and I'm looking at your kitchen. There is absolutely no woman in the kitchen. Maybe in the pastry over there. I need to work here." And he's like, "Whoa."
That night, actually put me on the line with Chef Sean. And Jeremiah Tower is the executive chef and owner. Mark France was the chef de cuisine at the time. And I was on... And they say, "Okay, you want to work there? Just go on the line with Sean. And we're going to do 600 covers. See how you show up." And then, two years later I was still there. And then, yeah.
Actually until today, I'm such a good friend with Mr. Jeremiah Tower. If you don't know him, there is a beautiful documentary about him. I'm not sure, I don't remember, “The Magnificent” or the “Last Magnificent.” But I think he's about in his '80s now. And he's incredible and we have a beautiful friendship. So, everything that why I'm here today is definitely of him.
Kerry Diamond:
How did you have the strength to walk into that kitchen and declare yourself?
Dominique Crenn:
An amazing father. My dad was a painter, but he was also a politician, and he always surround himself with strong women. And at a young age, he just told me, "You just got to go out there in this world and just be who you want to be. Don't let anybody to tell you you less. And if you want to ask something, always ask. Go and ask." Just the confidence. I think that's why a young chef out there, when they ask me, "I'm a woman. I don't know." It's like, "We have to have confidence with the self." I know confidence, and balls.
Kerry Diamond:
You are an immensely talented chef. You did not go to culinary school. You learned on the line. You have such a specific culinary vocabulary today. How did that develop?
Dominique Crenn:
I'm an artist, and I like to look at things differently, and use things as a language. Food has become a language for me and it's a way to communicate to someone. Food is not just food on the table and feeding people. I mean, it's one of them. It's very complicated. And also what comes from food, all the different branches. So, if you can use food and understand the purpose of it, then you can do everything you want.
We live in a world where food is the core of the society. It's also sold to a community. America is a beautiful country, very complicated. When I came here, I was very surprised. There is no food culture, actually. It's young. And people didn't take food as serious that they should. I also wanted to create a space where people could tell a story. And also, to build a team where they were seen by me, not like a number.
So it's nature. Nature is in front of you. You got to tell a story with nature. And if you want to put that on the plate, make sure that everything that you use, all the wine that you drinks, everything has a purpose. You have to know where things come from. You have to understand how they made. We all energy. So, food is energy. And if we don't care about what we're serving or who we buying the food from, we're in big trouble. I mean, look at what's going on today. It's a little bit crazy. But eat good food. It doesn't have to be expensive. Yeah, Atelier is expensive. But guess what? It's Atelier Crenn. But I also can serve sandwiches or things like that. It's a balance.
Kerry Diamond:
Could you do what you do anywhere except for California? I feel like California is so integral to you and what you do.
Dominique Crenn:
California is another world. It's a beautiful world. It's a place where people welcome new things. I mean, you can do anything you want to do when you put your heart into it. I don't know if other places, they will be... You talking about Atelier Crenn?
Kerry Diamond:
Yes. Let's talk about that.
Dominique Crenn:
No, Atelier Crenn is just going to stay in California. It's like I'm not going to do that. But I will open other things, other places in United States. Next year, actually.
Kerry Diamond:
Want to break any news right now?
Dominique Crenn:
No.
Kerry Diamond:
I tried. Okay.
Dominique Crenn:
No, I mean it's just such a beautiful industry. And I feel so grateful that I'm a part of, first of all, being here. Look at all those talented people. Very interesting.
Kerry Diamond:
I forgot to mention you are, like Tanya, also with the 2nd Jubilee. This is our 12th in-person Jubilee.
Dominique Crenn:
Oh, yes. That's amazing. Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah.
Dominique Crenn:
Hi, Tanya. What's up, baby?
Kerry Diamond:
California... Tanya's book is called “California Soul.” I feel like you are another person who embodies that. I look at Tanya, I look at you, and I think “California Soul” also applies to you.
Dominique Crenn:
I mean, California is such a beautiful place. What we have to understand is it's complicated. A lot of immigration, but also a lot of pain, with Chinese, Japanese and everything that happened during the Gold Rush and all of that. But this is a place where everybody came from different places. They put their luggage here and they come together as a community. And that's what is beautiful here. There's no judgment. There is no...
I mean, actually there is discrimination everywhere, but California is different. But it's also a learn of agriculture, a learn of history, a learn of curiosity of new things happening, a lot of outside of the box. Obviously there's a lot of company, AI and all that, which is great, but a lot of innovation here. And that's the only place in the United States actually that you find that.
I just love it. And the water. And I don't know. I really, really love it. I love California. I love the people here. And we get a bad rap all over the world, "Those crazy liberal." I just don't understand it. But we just here because we love our community. It doesn't matter what happened when. There is fires, we ride there at the forefront to help people. When COVID, which San Francisco was affected, almost two years of closing, outside cooking for everyone, the homeless population and the frontline helper. All of this, we are a community here, and that's why I love this place.
Kerry Diamond:
Folks might not realize you have a farm.
Dominique Crenn:
Oh, yes. Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
You want to tell us about your farm for a minute?
Dominique Crenn:
So, my ex-partner and I, which we have two beautiful kids together, Charlotte and Olivia, we found this farm in 2010. She bought it and had this vision about, "We have to work on the farm and work on the soul," not just for growing vegetable at the beginning. And then, after that it's like, "Wow, we have to really plant the seed here for the next generation to come."
And so, it's been 14 years, and the farm is amazing. It's a regenerative farm. It's also a farm that we bring people to educate people also. And it's just amazing for the last few years. You see, we have bees, we have different insects, different flowers, 36 different vegetable. And it's just hard to take care of a farm, but it's regenerative. And I think what we did is just plant the seed, and the next generation obviously can enjoy this farm. And it's amazing. Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
That's beautiful. I didn't realize it was 14 years.
Dominique Crenn:
14 year, and the farm is called Bleu Belle Farm. Bleu Belle Farm, which is the name also of my daughters, and so-
Kerry Diamond:
Beautiful.
Dominique Crenn:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Chef, one of the things I wanted to talk about that I admire so much about you is you are such a truth teller. And I want to talk about your breast cancer diagnosis a few years ago. You could have handled that privately. You did not. You shared it on social media. You shared it with your team. You shared it with a lot of us. And I'm just curious what leads you to be public about things like that?
Dominique Crenn:
Well, I think when you have a platform, and you see the pain of a lot of people... My dad had cancer. I was also working with UCSF for children, with a lot of young children that have chemo. So, cancer has been... We have to talk about it. I think as people look at, "Oh, you have cancer?" they're just kind of pushing you away.
But I realized that there is a lot of... It's the number of women. And I think that was right to do that. It's not to have any, "Hey, look at me. I have cancer." No. It's like, "Hey, I do have cancer." I've been working also with the Cancer Society for a long time before I knew I had cancer. And it was like you have to have a voice. You have to show and talk about it, and hopefully... And some other people that are afraid to talk about it, it's like, "Wow. Okay, I'm not alone."
So, remember, a lot of people feel that they are alone sometime. It doesn't have to be just with cancer, but other things. When you have a platform, you have to make sure that you give that platform to others. Yeah, triple negative. It was a shock. This is when I fell in love with this woman over there. I remember we knew each other. Can I tell the story, baby?
We met a year before, and we were just friend, and then we become very close. And I went away on my birthday. And this is when I decided... I just found out that I had cancer. And I came back to California. And she asked me to talk about our feeling together. And I said, "I don't know if I can be in a relationship. I just found out that I have cancer." And she said to me, "Okay, let's do cancer together." So, six years later, we are here married, and thank you.
Participants:
Ah.
Kerry Diamond:
Congratulations. That's remarkable. But I want to go back to... Maybe truth teller isn't even the right word, but where does that-
Participants:
Truth is important.
Kerry Diamond:
Where does that come from? Because I feel like that is-
Participants:
My dad.
Kerry Diamond:
... so central to you.
Dominique Crenn:
My dad, my mom always tell the truth. Try to tell the truth and don't be afraid because, if you hide behind something because you want people to like you, it doesn't work for me. I've been in the industry for a long time. Wow, a long time, almost 30 years. When I came up into this industry, people wanted you to be like the others, the guys and all that. And I think a lot of chefs and woman chef hide behind it.
I know it. I never give into that. You got to be true to yourself. You got to know who you are and don't be afraid. And if you're not invited, if you're not on top of the best restaurant in the world, if you don't have this award, who cares? Be you. Always tell the truth because one day, you're going to see, that's going to be your success.
As woman, we are so afraid sometime to say no. "Yes, yes, yes. Let's do this. Let's do that. Okay, I can do that." It's like do you think they care? They don't care. We have to come together and just really do it together. And I think this is important. Tell the truth. If you don't want to do this, if you not agree with this, it's okay.
If somebody tell you, "Oh, okay. Okay, Dominique, what are you going to do with Atelier? You guys going to do something that nobody's going to understand? You should go back and just cook some homey food and pasta." It's like, "No." It's like, "Don't tell me what to do. You don't make me. I make myself."
And that's important, guys. Nobody's going to make you. Nobody's going to tell you you can be the best you can because they're going to want something from you. Just know who you are. And it's difficult actually to get money, even for me raising money. But you got to do on your own and you got to push it.
Kerry Diamond:
You also are a very persistent person as you are implying.
Dominique Crenn:
Yeah, I know how to get things done.
Kerry Diamond:
What's your secret? Tell us.
Dominique Crenn:
I don't know, maybe my French accent.
Kerry Diamond:
That probably helps. That probably helps. I'm thinking of an incredible story you told me on the podcast. Earlier this year, you told me you always knew you were adopted. Your parents had been very open about that.
Dominique Crenn:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
And you found out that the adoption laws in France had changed. So, you were back in France and you decided that you wanted to find out more about your birth mother and your birth family. So, you marched into a municipal building, once again declared who you were, and asked to see the records.
Dominique Crenn:
Yes, so in France you-
Kerry Diamond:
That's not how it works in France-
Dominique Crenn:
No, it's-
Kerry Diamond:
... just FYI.
Dominique Crenn:
It's one of the most beautiful country in the world, but the bureaucracy is crazy. You have to write, you have to have an appointment. I mean, it's crazy. I mean, I just went to the desk, which is the place where they keep all the file, and I walked in, which was in Versailles. I said, "May I speak to someone in charge?" I spoke to the director, this woman. I said, "My name is Dominique Crenn and I was born this and this. And I was adopted. And there's a new law, so I want to look at my file." And she's like, "No, no, no, no, no. It doesn't work like this. You got to go to the website or you got to file a lot of..." And I'm like, "No, no, no, no, no, no, no. I don't live here. I live in United States. I would like if you can help me."
And then, I start to tell her my story. And then, we sat down, and she's like, "Wow, you're not crazy." And I'm like, "No." She said to me that, "A lot of young people that wanted to learn about their biological parents, a lot of them were anxious and angry, but it seems that you know more. Do you love your parents?" I said, "Yes, my parents are my parents." She's like, "It's easy to have a kid. It's not easy to be a parents." And she said, "Wow." And she say, "Well, give me your name, give me your birthdate, and give me what you have. And I will call you in a month."
And in a month, I was in Los Angeles, and I spent three hours on the phone with her, and she started to read my file. My file was very thick. It was incredible. It was incredible. And I'm like, "Okay, now what?" It's like, "Okay, I'm this and that, but what's the other side?" And yeah, it was kind of liberating. I wanted to find my birth mother because I wanted to tell her, "Thank you for giving me the chance to be loved." And then, the rest is history.
Kerry Diamond:
And that's another thing that you've been so open about and sharing with us that I want to thank you for.
Dominique Crenn:
Yeah, I was born in France, but I think it's also to help others when... I think maybe I carry this anxiety of being abandoned because I was abandoned, but I'm trying to work through that. But being loved by two people that really want you, it's incredible, and it changed my life. And I think I want to carry this through my life to make sure that, with my children, I want to love them. It's such a gift to have children. And you can adopt them or not. I mean, we had to go through different way to get also Charlotte and Olivia. It's so precious. So, I felt very lucky to have two wonderful people that wanted me. That's everything.
Kerry Diamond:
Love is another central theme in your life.
Dominique Crenn:
Yes, a lot of way.
Kerry Diamond:
Love, truth, persistence-
Dominique Crenn:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
... is one of them. You titled your memoir “Rebel Chef.”
Dominique Crenn:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
Why that title? I mean, you probably got a hint of why “Rebel Chef.” But in your mind, why did you want to call it that?
Dominique Crenn:
I like rules, because I think to be able to be free in this world, you also have to follow the rules of respecting the others. But the conventional rules are not the way that we live in this world. I think there is other way to do it, and not being afraid. So, trying to find another way, to find your own truth.
I think there is two type of people in the world. There is the followers that's going to follow someone that will tell them what to do and how to think. And there is also the second person, which is, I think, means the seeker of our own truth and the quest of our own truth. And I think I'm that person. I want to learn. I'm not always right. Most of the time, but I'm not always right. And I like also to have the information for me, and for me to perhaps change my mind. But you have to keep finding your own truth. So, you got to keep learning about, "Okay, what's the information here?" And I think that's why it's rebel for me.
And as a chef, I want to do my own things. I don't want to do something that other chef do, the same menu, and like, "Oh, my God. You have to add this, this on the menu. If you don't have this, then people are going to be against you." No, it's just like, "Dude, let me do what I want to do, and I want to tell a story." So, obviously it's working for me. So-
Kerry Diamond:
Exactly.
Dominique Crenn:
We don't have to please everyone. But what you have to do is you have to be genuine about what you're doing. And I think when you are genuine, and when you do something that you come from here... I'm inviting people to my home, and to surrender to my story. Don't come there with expectation on your high horse and thinking that you know everything. Because if you come to my home, and you're being disrespectful to my home and to the people that are going to serve you, you're going to go out. And I did that before. Everybody's welcome. But if you're an asshole, I'm sorry to say that, you get out.
I remember, it was a few years ago, these two guys came to Atelier Crenn with a big bottle of wine, like those big, how you call them-
Kerry Diamond:
Magnums?
Dominique Crenn:
Yeah, whatever, magnum. Horrible. Cabernet that you can find in a Vons or Safeway. And they just came, and they just put the big bottle on the table, and started to disrespect my server, this young woman, Cathy. And I watched them. And they keep disrespecting her.
I got out of the kitchen, and I went to the table, and they were like, "Oh, my God. Hi, Chef." And I say, "Hi, how are you?" I say, I'm so sorry, but you are here in my home. First of all, you're bringing a shitty wine. And second of all, which that should be the first things, you do not disrespect my employee. She's here and she's here also to help you to have a great experience. So, I'm going to tell you right now, I don't need your money. You take your wine and you get your ass out." And they did it. And I had a bad review on TripAdvisor or something like that. Whatever.
But you got to stand also for people that work with you. That's what it's important. Because money doesn't have that value for me. Money, it's what you do with it. But if you don't protect the people that are working with you, then who going to protect you? So, yes. No, the guest is not the king or the queen. I am the queen.
Kerry Diamond:
All right. I mean that's a great place to end. I have one last question for you. The next week and a half is going to be a little rough for a lot of us. And I've always admired-
Dominique Crenn:
So, we're talking about it today.
Kerry Diamond:
I've always admired you for so many thing, and I would love for you to just give... You are a wise person. I know you don't go around telling people that, but I've learned a lot from you over the years, and I'm grateful for our friendship and for what I've learned from you. Could you give us some wise words about how to handle the next week and a half?
Dominique Crenn:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
Good under pressure, Chef.
Dominique Crenn:
Absolutely. Whatever's going to happen is whatever's going to happen. If America want to go one way, they're going to go one way. If they want to go the other way, they're going to go the other way. What we have to do, as people, we have to organize. We have to support each other. We have to support the community. We have to really come together.
I'm a woman. I believe in the freedom of myself. Nobody tell me what to do. I have children, two daughters. I want them to be free. I want them to excel in this world. Young people... I don't want to be in a place where it just keeps people anxious. I don't want that. But we have to organize and we have to believe in ourself. In ourself. So, believe. I have a lot of hope. It's going to be okay. I'm telling you it's going to be okay. My gut's tell me that it's going to be okay.
Kerry Diamond:
Well, trusting your gut has gotten you this far, so I'm going to trust your gut on this one. So-
Dominique Crenn:
Yeah, trust your gut. It's going to be okay. Everything's going to be okay. I'm going to have a party no matter what.
Kerry Diamond:
All right. Well, Dominique, thank you so much-
Dominique Crenn:
No, thank you for everything.
Kerry Diamond:
... for everything, for being-
Dominique Crenn:
Thank you.
Kerry Diamond:
... here today.
That's it for today's show. I would love for you to subscribe to Radio Cherry Bombe on Apple Podcasts or Spotify and leave a rating and a review. Anyone you want to hear on an upcoming episode? Let me know. Our theme song is by the band Tralala. Joseph Hazan is a studio engineer for Newsstand Studios. Our producers are Catherine Baker and Jenna Sadhu. And our editorial coordinator is Sophie Kies. Thanks for listening everybody. You are the Bombe.