Molly Baz Transcript
Kerry Diamond:
Hi, everyone. You are listening to Radio Cherry Bombe, and I'm your host, Kerry Diamond, coming to you from Newsstand Studios at Rockefeller Center in the heart of New York City.
We are dropping a Wednesday episode because one of our favorite guests, Molly Baz, is back and she has some fun news. She is launching her first product line, it's called Ayoh, and her debut product is, surprise, mayonnaise. A divisive product for sure, but one I happen to love. If you are not Team Mayo, hang on, don't leave just yet. Molly and I catch up on lots of things, including her new life as a mom, her unexpected role as a breastfeeding champion. Go Molly. Or feeding your baby in whatever way works for you. I also find out what she's making for Thanksgiving. We talk turkey, of course, and my favorite, the Thanksgiving leftover sandwich. Stay tuned for my chat with Molly Baz.
Today's episode is presented by Kerrygold. Have you noticed that butter is having a moment? I've seen handbags sculpted out of butter. Little couches made from butter pats, tiny butter cherubs, even butter colored nail polish and fashion. The world is butter obsessed. But you know who loves butter more than most? The folks at Kerrygold. They've been perfecting their craft for decades, using milk from Irish grass-fed cows to create their famously rich, creamy, golden butter. There's a reason Kerrygold is beloved by everyone from home cooks to the world's top culinary creatives. It's just better butter. Kerrygold salted pure Irish butter has a butterfat content of 80%. While the unsalted version has a butterfat content of 82%. And that beautiful yellow color, it's thanks to beta-carotene, found naturally in milk from grass fed cows. Want to get in on the fun? Get yourself some Kerrygold and whip up some flavored compound butter, fill some fancy butter molds or sculpt one of those gorgeous butter mounds for your next dinner party or get together. Visit kerrygoldusa.com to learn more, get recipes and find a stockist near you.
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Now let's check in with today's guest. Molly Baz, welcome back to Radio Cherry Bombe.
Molly Baz:
Thank you for having me. I'm so happy to be back.
Kerry Diamond:
You are a mom. Since I saw you last, you gave birth to the world's cutest baby.
Molly Baz:
Oh my God. Stop. I know. How crazy that I get to be categorized as mom now. It's like chef, cookbook author, mom. That's new.
Kerry Diamond:
I have to ask, how's Tuna? Is Tuna doing okay with a sibling?
Molly Baz:
I'm so glad you asked. Here she is. She's right here with me. She's recording right next to me.
Kerry Diamond:
Hi, Tuna.
Molly Baz:
I would say I would give her a five out of 10 on how she's handling being a sibling, but we can only go up from here. It is a big transition for her and I have faith in her.
Kerry Diamond:
Is she jealous?
Molly Baz:
She's just skeptical. She's like, "What is this thing? That these limbs are flailing around and you seem to be holding him in your arms 90% of the day instead of me? So what exactly has happened here?"
Kerry Diamond:
For those of you who are like, "What is Tuna? Who is Tuna?" I know a lot of because Tuna was in Cherry Bombe when we shot Molly, but Tuna is Molly's beloved dachshund.
Molly Baz:
She's a little, teeny, tiny weenie.
Kerry Diamond:
Mr. Boots is the baby, not the baby's real name, but is Mr. Boots crawling?
Molly Baz:
No, not yet. Mr. Boots is five months in a couple of days, and so he's rolling but not crawling. We still have peace at the house. I am excited for the chapter when he starts moving around and I'm also terrified because right now I can plop him down, walk in the other room and make myself cappuccino and he can't get anywhere and that's about to change. So let's check in a couple of months and see how I'm doing.
Kerry Diamond:
I predict Mr. Boots and Tuna will be best friends.
Molly Baz:
I think so too.
Kerry Diamond:
I can't wait for that. We've got a lot to talk about. You have been so busy. It just blows my mind all the things that you've been doing, but we're going to start with your newest project. You are finally doing a product line. I know this personally. Your fans have been clamoring for this for a long time. Tell us the name of it and what it's all about.
Molly Baz:
Oh my gosh, I'm so excited. So I am launching a line of products called Ayoh. There's two ways to describe this line. You can either understand them as sando sauces because they are a line of condiments that are meant to upgrade your sandwiches, your sandwich game at home or as I like to refer to it, it's Mayo Gone Wild. It's everything you love about classic mayo, which is that it's adding fat and moistness and creaminess and flavor to your sandwich.
Except for I went ahead and added tons of ingredients and texture and flavor into each of the different SKUs and made a product that is kind of somewhere between a sauce and a mayonnaise and is really incredible on sandwiches and also awesome as salad dressings. And you will potentially catch me dipping chips and french fries into it as well.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh yum. Why would you start with the world's most divisive condiment?
Molly Baz:
Because I feel like controversy is a great place to start. You know how they say that all press is good press? That may not necessarily always be the case when it comes to mayonnaise I think it is, but mostly because I identified what I think is a white space in the market here and that's always obviously a great place to start when you're trying to come up with a product. I walked down the aisles of the grocery store and I spend a lot of time in the condiment section because I love condiments. And I noticed that there are a million iterations of every condiment in the world. And then you get to the mayonnaise department and it's kind of like everybody's making plain mayo.
And then there's a couple of players in the game who are making spicy mayo like sriracha mayo or chipotle mayo, but then that's kind of where it ends. There's a couple of brands who have dipped their toe in flavored mayonnaise, but really it's a category that has stayed pretty down the middle and hasn't veered off course much, and I feel like mayonnaise is just a canvas for flavor. Fat carries flavor.
Kerry Diamond:
I asked that question with all due respect because I adore mayonnaise.
Molly Baz:
Good. So you're on-
Kerry Diamond:
I absolutely love Mayo. I'm Team Mayo.
Molly Baz:
On the right side of things.
Kerry Diamond:
There hasn't been a lot of Mayo disruption. You've got Big Mayo represented by Hellman's. They still probably control a massive amount of the market. Sir Kensington came in, definitely tried to disrupt things a bit, but in the indie CPG arena, not too much.
Molly Baz:
No, there's a lot going on in the hot sauce world. There's a lot going on in the olive oil world. There's a decent amount going on in Vinegar Town, chili crisps, et cetera have blown up, but very few brands have touched Mayo and I think that's a missed opportunity. So I took the opportunity upon myself. I am a devout sandwich lover and I think maybe you recall, I used to have a sandwich podcast where I would just tackle a different iconic American sandwich in every episode. It was during the pandemic. I had nothing else to do and I was like, "Let's talk about sandwiches."
Kerry Diamond:
Wait, I had no idea. I thought I knew everything about you. What was this podcast called?
Molly Baz:
It was called the Sandwich Universe and it was hosted by me and one of my best friends, Declan, who is Mary Sue Millican's son.
Kerry Diamond:
Are you going to bring it back with the launch of Ayoh?
Molly Baz:
Maybe. It feels like there needs to be a season two. Season one, we hit the 10 most quintessential American sandwiches and each one was a deep dive into its history and created what we think is the ultimate version of that sandwich on the pod. But it was during that time that I really entrenched myself in sandwich making at home. I was eating sandwiches out in the world. It was a great thing during the pandemic to grab and go when you weren't sitting inside. I became pretty sandwich obsessed and I noticed that sandwiches that we get out in the world are phenomenal.
There's so many incredible sandwich shops because they have time and resources to pull out all the stops and make fun condiments and pickle their own onions and make their own fermented hot sauces and do all the things that really elevate a sandwich. And then you get back to your home kitchen and it's like nobody's going to do that for a sandwich. Maybe they'll project something like a Thanksgiving meal, but no one's spending hours and hours crafting a perfect sandwich at home because who's got time for that?
Kerry Diamond:
We'll be right back with today's guest. This episode is presented by Meridian Printing, the family-owned printing company based in East Greenwich, Rhode Island. Meridian has printed Cherry Bombe magazine for the past several years and it's always a pleasure working with the team at Meridian. They are meticulous and professional and care more than any other printer we've ever worked with. They are amazing partners. When I wanted to print three covers of our icons issue, they said, "No problem."
When I wanted to put a Molly Baz poster in every copy of our Molly issue, they said, "We got it." And they were amazing about helping us get the pink shade just right for our new Ina Garten issue. If you have an idea for a magazine or a zine or maybe you want to do books on demand, you should talk to the team at Meridian Printing. Visit meridianprinting.com for more information.
You're launching with four flavors, right?
Molly Baz:
So we have an original mayo, which is just creamy mayo that I'm hoping will hang with the rest of the big wigs in the aisle. I've been a Duke's fan as of late. I grew up on Hellman's and then I switched over to Duke's once I learned of it. And then also I'm a huge fan of Kewpie. Our creamy mayo is, I don't know, it's unlike the others. It's very light on the palate and almost fluffy. It kind of dissolves in this really nice way and it's got just a nice hit of acid. Anyway, I think it's pretty phenomenal. So we've got creamy mayo, but then the real stars of the show are the three flavored skews. We have Dill Pickle Mayo, we have Hot Giardinayo, which is Giardiniera and Calabrian chilies stirred into mayonnaise with a bunch of other yummy stuff.
And then we have Dijonayo, which is a take on that classic mustard mayo condiment, but we've also added a ton of chopped cornichon pickles because the thing about these sando sauces as we're calling them is they're not just about flavor, they're also about texture. So they're packed with chopped pickles and pickled peppers and roasted peppers and all sorts of little bits and bobs so that there's a textural eating experience as well as a flavor bomb.
Kerry Diamond:
I can't wait to try these. I do love tuna salad. Very particular about my tuna salad. Which of those would you make tuna salad with?
Molly Baz:
Dill pickle in tuna salad is so good. Making tuna salad at home can be kind of annoying because to make it really good, you got to start chopping pickles and maybe you want to chop some herbs and then you need mustard and mayo and you need a little lemon juice and acid and it's like you actually end up spending a lot of time making tuna salad, which is silly. With the dill pickle Ayoh, it's like just put dill pickle Ayoh on-
Kerry Diamond:
I'm very excited. I kind of mash the heck out of my tuna until it's practically like a pate. Love. So I'm going to do that. I also love potato salad. Which would you do potato salad with?
Molly Baz:
So I would say the Dijonayo. The Dijonayo would be a fantastic potato salad one-stop shop. Boil some potatoes, toss with Dijonayo. If you want to throw some dill or parsley on it, fine, but you're good.
Kerry Diamond:
Yum. I also love coleslaw. How about coleslaw?
Molly Baz:
So perfect. We'll complete the trifecta. You could make a spicy coleslaw with the Hot Giardinayo and add in. I made a slaw the other day that was cabbage, Hot Giardinayo, basil and thinly sliced red onion. So good.
Kerry Diamond:
Nice. Good. Well, I'm all set. Let's talk about having a product line because I know enough about you to know that when you get into something, you really, really get into it. So I'm curious how the whole R&D process went, naming the product. Let's start with why you even wanted a CPG line and a lot of you know what that term means, but its consumer packaged goods. Why did you even want a CPG line in the first place?
Molly Baz:
I wanted a CPG line because I have basically two missions on this planet. One is to feed people and the other is to teach people how to feed themselves. And so everything I do trickles down into one of those camps and if it doesn't, I'm not really interested in doing it. And that's how I think about building my businesses. I realize that a lot of my work to date has fallen into the teach people how to feed themselves category. Obviously my cookbooks, my startup Bon Appetit being on the YouTube channel, they're my own YouTube channel now, my recipe club, all of that is empowering people to feed themselves. Incredible, love it. It's the thing that I will do till the day I die.
But I realized that there are some people who just aren't interested in cooking but they love to eat and that I'm sort of missing that whole sector of the population by only creating content that encourages people to cook for themselves. And so that's where the product line comes in, where it's like I still want people to be able to have access to my food and I want to feed people, whether it be directly or through them feeding themselves. And so the product line, especially with something like Ayoh, which is created in order to eliminate the need to cook, is to reach those people. As for the name, we threw out a bunch of names at the beginning.
I honestly can't even remember what they were because I was at a Halloween party and we were just hanging out carving pumpkins with a bunch of friends and one of my friends, we posed the question to everyone. We were like, "Guys, what should I call my Mayo company? What's the one word line? I want this to feel like it's been around forever and I want it to live on forever." And one of my friends just goes, "Ayoh." Straight up, he pulled it out immediately. He was really soft-spoken about it, just confidently like, "Ayoh." And I was like, "We're done here. That's the name." It stuck and it's been the name ever since.
Kerry Diamond:
It's so perfect. It makes absolute sense for you. Are you just going to do these four products or are you thinking this is going to eventually be an entire condiments line?
Molly Baz:
I think we'll expand. I am trying to stay laser focused right now because one thing I've learned in everything I do in my career is the value of focusing on the few and not trying to do everything all at once or even really anticipate what every next move is. So I'm really trying to focus on this being the category that I'm tackling right now and I want to master it before I move on to other things. I do have other SKUs in the works because if you think about it, mayo is really just like a canvas for flavor. There's sort of infinite possibility in terms of other flavors that we can come out with.
I really want to do collabs and bringing other chefs or other brands to do collab flavors. So I think there's a lot of potential to expand Ayoh that way, but then eventually, yes, I think if this company is a success and people are loving the product, I would like to expand it out into other categories. The first one that comes to mind is salad dressings. I always have had a deep desire slash need to make a Caesar salad dressing obviously. All of the work that we're doing for Ayoh I think is propping me up to do that really well.
Kerry Diamond:
And do you think all this will be under the umbrella of Ayoh? Is that the name you've chosen to move forward with?
Molly Baz:
I think Ayoh Foods will be the umbrella company, the Best Foods if you will, and then there will be other product lines that come out from it.
Kerry Diamond:
How did you find a partner? That's always a tough part of this.
Molly Baz:
Through a lot of conversations. We got connected to my business partner, David McCormick, through conversations that I was having with a couple of other people who work in building CPG businesses and it was sort of like a snowball effect of we got in touch with this woman and she was interested in what my sort of hopes and dreams in the CPG space was. She didn't have time for it at the moment, but she connected me to David who has done a ton of work in this space. I've been talking about what my product line will be with people for years and just taking informational meetings, chats, coffees with people until I kind of found my way to the right partner. And that is David and he is incredible.
Kerry Diamond:
Talk to us about the R&D process. I imagine that was a lot, but fun.
Molly Baz:
I mean it's a very, very different process than the recipe development that I do for my books, which is interesting. However, it really did start the same way. When I developed recipes for my cookbooks. I'm in my home kitchen, I'm pulling ingredients out of my pantry, cooking, taking notes, feeding them to my husband for dinner that night and assessing how we did and deciding whether it makes it into a book. The Ayoh flavors came about much in the same way initially where I was making sandwiches at home all the time and testing them out on friends, myself, my husband and those turned into the SKUs. But from there took a very different route than they normally do, which is just to turn into a recipe, but went through formulation.
And that's a process that I had never done before, which is figuring out how to commercialize a product and make sure that it is shelf stable and has the right pH and that we can get the exact right pickle at scale in a consistent way. There's so many considerations to make and so the scale up and commercialization process has been really interesting. I'm going actually next week for my next round of tastings at the plant where it's all made and even that is you walk into these plants, it doesn't look like a kitchen. It's very industrial. They're making 2,500 pound batches of our mayonnaise. That's a whole nother world that I have just entered.
Kerry Diamond:
Have you enjoyed the process?
Molly Baz:
So much so. I love doing new things in my career and it's related to what I know and do well, but at a whole nother level and there are people that I have been working with that have such expertise in this that really exceed anything that I am good at and it's so amazing to tap into those new avenues.
Kerry Diamond:
How about the distribution? Will this be direct to consumer or do you have some retail partners?
Molly Baz:
So it'll be direct to consumer to begin with. We're launching on November 19th and then pretty soon after we'll be in grocery. So the idea is Q1 of next year, so 2025 we will be finding our grocery partners and there'll be... Hopefully you'll find us in every little shop-py shop that you expect to see a product like this in. But even bigger than that, I think our hope is to be in a Sprouts or a Whole Foods and really be able to reach a lot of people. The whole concept of Ayoh is that it's a brand for everyone. I don't want it to be elitist and only available on the coasts and only in expensive shops. I want it to be an everyman product and something that's just table stakes in people's fridges.
Kerry Diamond:
But you do know this will be the foodie gift of the holidays for 2024.
Molly Baz:
I'm hoping. I am hoping.
Kerry Diamond:
That's going to be interesting. I know everyone's going to, on November 19th, try to get their hands on this product.
Molly Baz:
I know. I'm very excited for that.
Kerry Diamond:
It's very exciting. And did I hear there's some kind of Ayoh or sandwich tour?
Molly Baz:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
What's that all about?
Molly Baz:
So we're going to send Ayoh on tour, much like you would send a musician on tour. Basically we're going to team up with iconic sandwich shops all around the country in different cities and have them come up with a couple of special menu items that feature Ayoh and do a one-day menu takeover of Ayoh at their sandwich shop. And so we'll announce the tour in the next couple of weeks once Ayoh is launched and people can that way get the taste of Ayoh and what it's really like by going to their favorite sandwich shop. Some of them will sell Ayoh as well and we'll just send it around the country for as long as people will have it.
Kerry Diamond:
Your team sent over some stats to me and the most interesting one I read, and this is going to gross people out if they're not Team Mayo, but Americans on average eat four pounds of mayo a year. Is that true?
Molly Baz:
Oh my God, I must eat 16. Four pounds feels really low ball for me, but I guess that is to be expected as the founder of a mayo company.
Kerry Diamond:
I was guessing my consumption is probably eight pounds. So I guess it makes sense that you do double that.
Molly Baz:
I would double that for sure. People either love or hate mayo, but the mayo lovers really hold it down for us, you know what I mean? They're doing four pounds a year.
Kerry Diamond:
Let's talk about a few other things since we have you here. You have become a breastfeeding advocate and I'm guessing-
Molly Baz:
What do you know?
Kerry Diamond:
You never... That was not on your bingo card for 2024.
Molly Baz:
It was not.
Kerry Diamond:
How did that happen?
Molly Baz:
It's a great question. It's funny when I think back to the woman, the person that I was two years ago, I distinctly remember having conversations with friends and being like, this is before I even got pregnant, basically being like, "I don't know what to do because if and when I get pregnant, how do I avoid being a mom influencer? Because I never want to be that, but it's going to be so hard to be pregnant and be a mom but not want to talk about it. Everyone's going to see that I'm pregnant and have a baby. How do I toe that line?"
Kerry Diamond:
You've shared so much. How do you all of a sudden stop sharing one of the most important things in your life?
Molly Baz:
Exactly. And I really stressed about it. Then made the decision to get pregnant because it was time, it felt right. I felt like I had things set up in the way that I wanted my life to bring someone else into it.
Kerry Diamond:
Not to ask you a super personal question, but were you pregnant on the cover?
Molly Baz:
I was.
Kerry Diamond:
You were. Oh, that's so cool.
Molly Baz:
I was pregnant on the cover and I remember being like, "Oh God, I really hope that I don't pop yet." I think I was maybe two weeks pregnant. I had no idea what the journey of a pregnant body was.
Kerry Diamond:
We had so many pregnant folks on the cover last year.
Molly Baz:
I know. I love that.
Kerry Diamond:
It was a really special year. We need to see what all those babies are up to. But anyway, congrats to all the moms who are on our cover and thank you for sharing that with Cherry Bombe. That was really special. Talking to your friends, not knowing what was going to happen.
Molly Baz:
And then I got pregnant and I realized, "Don't overthink this. Just be you, continue to be you. You will feel your way through it all." I let go of any preconceived notion I had of how I would show up as a mom or not on social and publicly and just let myself be where I was. Soon enough I realized, "Wow, I love being pregnant. This is so fun and cool, and watching my body change is the most joyous, rewarding thing that has ever happened to me. And I'm going to share that." So that was step one, just being pregnant and putting my belly out all the time. I was like, "This is so crazy. I have a belly now. Let's show it."
So I would just wear crop tops out in the world and flaunt it because I was excited about it. So I was sort of dipping my toe into sharing that side of my life. And then I ended up doing that Swehl campaign. For those of you guys who don't know what Swehl is, Swehl is a company that's all about empowering women to breastfeed. And they reached out to me and asked me if I would develop a lactation cookie for them as a pregnant woman who was about to have a baby and about to potentially be nursing. I was like, "Let's do it and let's have fun with it." And so we came up with this sort of fun wild, silly campaign where I made cookies in the shape of boobs.
And they shot me and then they were like, "We're going to put this up in Times Square." And I was like, "All right." Again, just living in the moment and not overthinking what does this say about my image or how does this relate back to the version of myself I didn't know I wanted to be? I just was in every moment asking myself if this felt right and if it felt right moving forward. And that's how we got to where we are. That billboard came out. I did a campaign for Special K with my big belly out on a cereal box. And now as of today, we're up in Times Square with me breastfeeding the child that came out of me. Loud and proud.
And so I'm really just embracing what comes my way and not judging myself for it.
Kerry Diamond:
You aren't judging yourself, but other people did. The first billboard got taken down. Tell us why.
Molly Baz:
It did. It got taken down because it was deemed inappropriate content or it violated the guidelines for what is acceptable content to be promoted on the clear channel billboards in Times Square. That was pretty enraging and spurred a lot of talk and controversy. And in a weird way, I am grateful that it got taken down because it got to bring a lot more awareness to an issue that otherwise if it hadn't gotten taken down, a lot less people would've seen that billboard because you got to be in Times Square to see it. But instead it spurred this whole new cycle about what is going on in media and why is it that there are skinny naked women on billboards in Calvin Klein ads that are up for months and months and totally accepted.
And then you throw a woman with a pregnant belly up there and it's like, "Oh my God, take that down. What are we doing?" And I kind of stepped into this role of being a spokesperson for embracing the pregnant body. Like I mentioned, I was so excited by my changing body and proud to share it in my own world and on my own socials and through this campaign. And I feel like all women should feel what that feels like and not be ashamed of it.
Kerry Diamond:
Now you are working with Bobbie, which is a formula company.
Molly Baz:
Do you know how inconvenient it is to have to remove yourself every two hours from a social setting or a public setting and put yourself into some really disgusting bathroom or nursing zone? I just refuse to do it. People, even today, for example, I went to the factory that I work that were making Ayoah at, and they very graciously were like, "Here, we have this little room for you to nurse in." And I so appreciate that gesture, but I'm kind of like, "No, I'm good. I'm going to sit right here in the middle of this meeting and pump."
I'm not ashamed of the fact that I'm pumping and I don't really care if you guys are weirded out. We're in the middle of a meeting. I'm not going to excuse myself and go sit in a conference room. So it's pretty wild.
Kerry Diamond:
Has your own audience been comfortable with this or have you gotten pushback from them?
Molly Baz:
No, I mean I think my audience is very empowered by it. I think I have a lot of moms and women now who follow me, especially following the Swehl campaign. But then news kind of got out around that campaign for Bobbie and people... I think actually with that campaign, where I see more discomfort is around people having opinions about whether formula feeding is okay or good for your baby. There's a lot going on in that image. Obviously I'm breastfeeding publicly loud and proud. So that's one thing that we're not used to seeing. But then also I'm endorsing combo feeding, which involves introducing formula to an infant or a child whose four months at the time.
I'm proud of that decision and feel like that's another arena in which there's so much shame and stigma. There's something so pure about the idea of breastfeeding. So everybody wants us to breastfeed because it's the best possible source of nutrition for our babies and they don't want us to introduce formula. But then also they don't want to see us breastfeed. It's like the double standard is beyond.
Kerry Diamond:
And they also don't want to pay for childcare.
Molly Baz:
And then there's that. There's so much to unpack in this arena that I am now realizing, and I just never took the time to really think about all of this double standard and all of the sort of inequity in this space.
Kerry Diamond:
We'll be right back with today's guest. Cherry Bombe's next Jubilee conference is taking place in New York City on April 12th. Early bird tickets are on sale right now at cherrybombe.com. If you're an official Bombesquad member, be sure to check your inbox for special member pricing. Jubilee is a conference we started in 2014 as a way to bring women together for networking, conversation and community. It's a beautiful day filled with friends, new and old, great talks and panels and amazing things to eat and drink. This year's Jubilee will be our biggest and our best one yet. Again, visit cherrybombe.com for early bird tickets. Prices will go up January 1st. The link is in our show notes.
Let's talk about a few other things. Drink this wine. You have your great wine line, which I personally love. You launched some new wines.
Molly Baz:
We just launched our latest fall releases. So we have a winter white, which is really fun. It's a kind of big, broad, oily, white wine, which we've never done before. And then a winter-y gamy blend that I'm very excited about.
Kerry Diamond:
All right, go back to oily. People might be like, "What? Oily wine."
Molly Baz:
It's like the way that it kind of lingers on your palate. If you think about a really lean acidic wine, it's sort of the opposite of that. So this white wine that we just released, I tell people to pair it with acidic things, so I love it with pickles. I drink this wine and I eat pickles with really vinegary salads or a vinegar braised chicken. It's really good with things that are more like sharp and biting because it's a quite round and warm white.
Kerry Diamond:
You love bold flavor.
Molly Baz:
I do.
Kerry Diamond:
Talk to me about the holidays. What are you and the fam going to be up to?
Molly Baz:
We are going up to Sonoma to rent a house for Thanksgiving. I will probably pack my kitchen in my car and drive it up so that I ensure that I don't arrive at an Airbnb rental without what I need. And then for Christmas, every year I normally go home to Upstate New York, which is where I grew up. My parents still have the house I grew up in, but last year we sort of did farewell to that tradition.
I've done it 36 times in my life and I want to start a new family tradition around the holidays in our house. And so we're going to stay in California and I'm going to try to honor the Christmas tradition that my parents spent so much time and energy making magical for us growing up and pass it on to Boots this year. So we'll be in California in L.A.
Kerry Diamond:
A California Christmas. That sounds like fun. Talk to me about Thanksgiving. What's a Molly Baz Thanksgiving?
Molly Baz:
Well, this year I just came out of a deep recipe development hole where I've been working on Thanksgiving recipes. So I'll be releasing recipes every Friday in my club in November. I do turkey every year. I never do a whole turkey. I don't believe in a whole roasted Turkey. I think it's the worst way to cook a turkey. This year I'm doing a braised turkey. So it's like you buy a turkey and you ask the butcher or the person at the butcher counter at your Whole Foods or whatever to break it down into legs, drumsticks, thighs, breasts, and it gets braised in a spicy, vinegary, kind of sweet, maple, chili crisp, apple cider vinegar situation with kabocha squash.
And the squash cooks in with the turkey for three hours and it just soaks up all of that flavor. There are shallots and garlic and it's just a really great way to treat turkey and ensure that it doesn't dry up. So that's probably what I'll make this year. However, I have had it maybe four times in the last two weeks, so I might switch things up just for the sake of palate fatigue.
Kerry Diamond:
That is the sexiest sounding turkey I have ever heard of but how do you have a pot big enough to braise it in?
Molly Baz:
So it fits in a standard turkey roasting pan. So the same pan you would roast your whole turkey in, you just break it down and it all braises covered with foil in that same pan.
Kerry Diamond:
That's great. Where are you on the whole stuffing thing? What kind of stuffing do you do?
Molly Baz:
I love stuffing. I grew up on the Pepperidge farm stuff.
Kerry Diamond:
Classic.
Molly Baz:
And love. We always added sausage in. If I were to make my own stuffing, I always make the Simple-Is-Best Stuffing which is a recipe on bonappetit.com that is just so classic. You got to use really nice sourdough. I go for a classic homemade stuffing or I'll do Pepperidge Farms. I love stuffing it in the turkey. If I'm at someone else's house and they're whole roasting a turkey, I'm going straight for the stuffing inside.
Kerry Diamond:
Wait, aren't you supposed to not do that anymore?
Molly Baz:
You're supposed to, but I'm like, "Are you kidding?" Most people overcook their turkeys. I definitely think the stuffing is cooked.
Kerry Diamond:
Cranberries.
Molly Baz:
I never used to like it. And then I kind of had this realization a couple of years ago that the cranberry sauce serves such an important function at the table, I think because I maybe grew up having an overly sweet version of it. And then once I started making it myself and working at Bon Appetit and working on cranberry sauce recipes, I realized this is the only tart thing on many Thanksgiving tables. Not on mine because I pay a lot of attention to the importance of acid and vinegar on the Thanksgiving table. But if you walk into most people's homes on Thanksgiving, it's all carbs and fat, and the cranberry is such a nice relief from it.
Kerry Diamond:
I cut the sugar significantly when I make homemade cranberry sauce.
Molly Baz:
I think you have to. You don't need it. Also, dessert is coming. It's right around the corner and you're going to eat 17 pies.
Kerry Diamond:
Absolutely. I have a fight with my family every year. Canned versus fresh.
Molly Baz:
I always go fresh but we were never a canned fam.
Kerry Diamond:
I'm a team of one. My family loves the canned cranberry sauce.
Molly Baz:
Oh, really? But you don't love it.
Kerry Diamond:
I lose that fight every year, and sorry mom, I'm going to out you right now. But my mother will serve it, it still has the ridges on the-
Molly Baz:
You got to respect where it came from.
Kerry Diamond:
How about the Thanksgiving turkey sandwich the next day?
Molly Baz:
So glad you asked. Another thing that I've spent maybe too much of my life thinking about, I don't want to eat the entire Thanksgiving table in between two slices of bread.
Kerry Diamond:
I disagree. Molly.
Molly Baz:
Well, so for me, it's like the day after I want to eat the leftovers, I want to heat up a plate of leftovers and experience the same thing the next day. I think they always taste better the next day. So I'm trying to have round two of the meal where all the flavors have married. So then the third day when the turkey breast is starting to get a little dry and sad, that's when the sandwiches come into play.
And that's when I'm like, "I'm good. I don't need any more mashed potatoes. I don't need any more stuffing and I want completely different flavor." And this year I developed three sandwiches for Thanksgiving leftovers. None of which feature anything other than the turkey, but all which use Ayoh. And they're very delicious.
Kerry Diamond:
So is this a turkey salad situation?
Molly Baz:
So one of them is a turkey salad, one of them is a turkey melt. So it's all the things you love about a tuna melt, but you're making turkey salad instead. I put a bunch of really thinly sliced Asian pear in there with Swiss cheese and this dill pickle Ayoh turkey salad and griddle it up. It's so good. One of them is what I've called the ham and cram, which is for people who don't eat turkey on Thanksgiving but eat a baked ham, which I know is a smaller portion of the population, but they're out there.
And that one uses cranberry sauce on one side of the bread and the Ayoh Dijonayo on another side, and then ham and cheese. And then the third one that I worked on, which I'm really excited about, is a spicy turkey club. So it's a triple-decker club with Sobrassada instead of bacon that you crisp up and then Hot Giardinayo slathered all over with potato chips.
Kerry Diamond:
You are good at your job, Molly Baz. That sounds great. Now I like the basic good bread, a little toasted, not fully toasted, with the layer of turkey, cranberry and stuffing with a ton of mayo.
Molly Baz:
Well at least you're hitting the mayo. You can use Ayoh mayo for that.
Kerry Diamond:
All right, let's do a little speed round. What beverage do you start your morning with?
Molly Baz:
A pistachio milk cappuccino.
Kerry Diamond:
Sweetened, unsweetened.
Molly Baz:
The pistachio milk is lightly sweetened.
Kerry Diamond:
Do you use Tache or somebody else's?
Molly Baz:
I use Tache. I use the original, not the unsweetened one because I feel like it needs a tiny bit of sweetness.
Kerry Diamond:
Got it. What's always in your fridge?
Molly Baz:
Oh my goodness. Herbs, so many herbs, jars and jars of herbs, and then tons and tons of condiments, pickles, so many pickles. Pickles and herbs.
Kerry Diamond:
You are our dill queen. Whenever I have dill in my fridge, I always think of you. What are you streaming right now?
Molly Baz:
Oh, my goodness. Nothing. Honestly, the last three nights me and Ben have laid in bed being like, "What are we doing?" Watching reruns of Friends. So that's kind of how dire it's for me.
Kerry Diamond:
Is that because of the political situation or just all the stuff you have going on?
Molly Baz:
I can't watch that before bed. Kind of feel like I'm entrenched in the news all the time and then before bed I need something mindless. And so I have been watching Friends.
Kerry Diamond:
What was your favorite childhood food?
Molly Baz:
That's a great question that no one's ever asked me. I want to ask my parents what they would say to that. One of my strongest childhood memories, maybe this is coming up just because we're talking about Thanksgiving, but I remember so deeply loving the Libby's pumpkin pie that I would make with my dad every year at Thanksgiving. It was always our job to make it and we would make it different every year. We would always add some kind of little special ingredient, whether it was a little maple syrup or a honey or this and that was our special thing. And I love an artisanal pumpkin pie, but give me a slice of Libby's pumpkin pie. And I'm straight back to childhood.
Kerry Diamond:
What's your favorite food smell?
Molly Baz:
Probably the smell of a steak coming off of a wood-fired grill.
Kerry Diamond:
What's your favorite food movie?
Molly Baz:
I just recently watched that new film with Juliette Binoche. Did you see it?
Kerry Diamond:
“The Taste of Things.”
Molly Baz:
“The Taste of Things.” And the movie was quite slow, but I had just gotten back from a trip to Paris and a trip to the French countryside and I was living in a chateau that looked a lot like the house that she cooked in. And so it was very transformative and meditative for me. And the cinematography around the food in that film is incredible.
Kerry Diamond:
There's not too much of a plot, but if you are in food and care at all about food styling or kitchens, you have to watch that movie.
Molly Baz:
Must.
Kerry Diamond:
What's your favorite kitchen implement or tool?
Molly Baz:
Probably the microplane, I think it's called for in 80% of my recipes.
Kerry Diamond:
Cool. Dream travel destination.
Molly Baz:
Japan. I've been dying to go back to Japan. I want to go with Willett. I've never been with my husband and I need to eat around that country again.
Kerry Diamond:
I've never been. It's at the top of my list. Last question. If you had to be trapped on a desert island with one food celebrity, who would it be and why?
Molly Baz:
Oh my God, you have to be so strategic about this. I feel like I'd have to say... I don't know if this counts. I think this is a celebrity. Francis Mallmann is probably who I'd want to be on a desert island with because I know he would make a mean long-lasting fire and we would be really well-fed. I don't even know him personally, but I'm like, "I want this guy by my side."
Kerry Diamond:
Well, maybe now you'll be friends, but that's a good practical answer. Molly Baz gives us lots of insight into your brain. Well listen, so great to talk to you. Congratulations on this launch.
Molly Baz:
Thank you, Kerry. So good to see your face and thanks for the chat.
Kerry Diamond:
That's it for today's show. Did you know The Cherry Bombe Podcast Network has a baking podcast? We do. It's called She's My Cherry Pie. It is the number one baking podcast in the country. A new episodes drop on Saturdays. It's hosted by Jessie Sheehan. If you are a baker, a baked good lover, a baker lover, whatever, give a listen. Radio Cherry Bombe's theme song is by the band Tralala. Joseph Hazan is the studio engineer at Newsstand Studios at Rockefeller Center. Our producers are Catherine Baker and Jenna Sadhu. And our editorial coordinator is Sophie Kies. Thanks for listening everybody. You are the Bombe.