Nadiya Hussain Transcript

Nadiya Hussain Transcript

Kerry Diamond:
Hi, everyone. You are listening to Radio Cherry Bombe. I'm your host Kerry Diamond, coming to you from Rockefeller Center in the heart of New York City. Each week, we talk to the coolest culinary personalities around, the folks shaping and shaking up the food scene. I'm so excited because today's guest is Nadiya Hussain, the winner of The Great British Bake Off and the author of more than a dozen books, including some terrific cookbooks. Nadiya was in town recently to work on the GREAT Calling campaign, a program to promote all that is special about Great Britain, including of course it's food and drink. The last time we spoke with Nadiya was back in 2020, so I am excited to catch up with her, get her thoughts on New York City and learn what she's been up to. Today's episode is presented by Kerrygold, the makers of beautiful butter and cheese with milk from Irish grass fed cows.

I've been to Ireland with Kerrygold and have visited some of the small family farms they work with and the care they put into their product every step of the way is amazing. I'm guessing a lot of you listening today are bakers, so you know how the best ingredients, especially butter, can a real difference in your baked goods. Whether you're making scones and all butter pie crust, or my favorite, a carrot cake with buttercream frosting, shout out to everybody who's on team buttercream, you want the best ingredients you can source. If you haven't tried Kerrygold, look for their butter and cheese at your favorite supermarket or specialty grocery store. Visit kerrygoldusa.com for recipes, product information, and a store locator. Today's show is also sponsored by Foxtrot. Foxtrot is the modern corner store that's redefining convenience. Foxtrot has locations in Chicago, Dallas, Washington, D.C., and Virginia. If you're lucky enough to live in one of those cities, you can go visit. Foxtrot also has a website packed with all of our favorite products, and national shipping is available.

But what I want to tell you about is Foxtrot's second annual UP & COMERS Awards. Foxtrot wants to find the next big thing in food. Is that your brand? If so, the application is now live at foxtrotco.com/upandcomers. I suggest you go check it out, and you can find that link in our show notes. You have until April 4th to apply, winners will receive a spot on Foxtrot shelves, plus funding, marketing support, and mentorship from some of the biggest names in food. What else? Little housekeeping. Jubilee is less than two weeks away. Oh my gosh, that makes me kind of break count in a sweat just saying that. We can't wait to see everyone. Be sure to check cherrybombe.com for all the updates about talent, schedules and more. We've also got, and I'm very excited about this, our first ever New York City dining guide. We did this in partnership with Resy, it's on the site, and we share our favorite Brooklyn and Manhattan female fueled restaurants. Be sure to check it out. Now, let's chat with today's guest.

Nadiya Hussain, welcome to Radio Cherry Bombe.

Nadiya Hussain:
Thank you for having me again.

Kerry Diamond:
I know I should say welcome back to Radio Cherry Bombe. You are here in New York work for the GREAT campaign?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yes.

Kerry Diamond:
Can you tell us what the GREAT campaign is all about?

Nadiya Hussain:
This campaign is all about changing Americans' perceptions of British food. Because I often get asked, what is British food? I think there is this misconception that British cuisine doesn't exist. To be able to come out here and share my love of British food and the way I cook is a wonderful thing. It's a wonderful thing. If we can change just one person's mind, it's job well done.

Kerry Diamond:
Mission accomplished. You are a food ambassador of sorts?

Nadiya Hussain:
Of sorts. Yes.

Kerry Diamond:
Okay. I think we need more food ambassadors.

Nadiya Hussain:
That's a good role. I like that. Yeah.

Kerry Diamond:
There'd be more peace in the world if we had food ambassadors from every country communicating with each other. What does that mean? How will you be changing our hearts and minds?

Nadiya Hussain:
The GREAT campaign runs over the month of March and I'm going to be here and I'm going to be doing demonstrations and talking about the food that I cook and how I cook and answering anybody's questions. But this is all about challenging perceptions. It's about changing people's views of British food, British music, travel, sports, that kind of thing. For me, it's all about the food. I'm here as the food person who is here to challenge those perceptions.

Kerry Diamond:
When you think about British cuisine, a lot of people automatically just think fish and chips here in America. I'm so curious. When you say to someone from the UK, what do you think of American food, what's the first thing that comes to mind? I'm almost afraid to ask you that question.

Nadiya Hussain:
Before I traveled to America a lot more than I have now, I used to think it was fries and burgers and milkshake. Much like I think people have this idea that British food is very much just English breakfasts-

Kerry Diamond:
A pint.

Nadiya Hussain:
... and pint and fish and chip. Actually, it's much more than that. I suppose for me as somebody who's traveled in America, it's so much more than burgers, fries, and milkshake. I've had the privilege of being able to explore that. I know there are loads of people who may never come to the UK, but if they are going to come, what is it that's going to bring them to the UK? I'm telling you, it's the food, because food, it's such a massive melting pot of people that we have got recipes and we've got dishes that are specific to certain parts of England. But in and around all of that, there are those little pockets, the little holes in the wall, where there are so many other cuisines that you can enjoy. That's through immigration and people moving around, and I'm really proud of that.

Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. We're going to get into that in just a minute. You've already been a food ambassador of sorts through The Great British Bake Off because that is just popular around the world.

Nadiya Hussain:
That's an institute in itself, isn't it?

Kerry Diamond:
It is. You've taught a lot of us about British bake goods that we had no idea about. It's so interesting to me that The Great British Bake Off has now become this iconic British export. When I was thinking of other iconic British exports, I was like, "Okay, the Beatles, Burberry, James Bond." I was like, "They all have a B in them. Why is that?"

Nadiya Hussain:
Why is that?

Kerry Diamond:
But I'm curious, how does it feel to be part of something that is so beloved around the world?

Nadiya Hussain:
To be honest, when I did Bake Off, it wasn't as everybody didn't know about it. Or maybe they did and I didn't know about it. Maybe that was naivety on my part. But to be a part of the biggest baking show in the world, I mean, essentially the home of Bake Off is in England. To be a part of that is a wonderful and unlikely thing for me because I grew up cooking in the kitchen. I didn't grow up baking. For me to be a part of that and recognized for that is a wonderful thing, but it is, it's an institute. I think there's something about watching amateur bakers fall apart on television that everybody loves. I don't understand why. It's a little bit weird. What I love about the recipes on Bake Off are, a lot of the recipes when I was doing Bake Off, they were very traditional recipes, lots of recipes that people hadn't heard of. They've definitely expanded more now and they've got much more kind of exotic different recipes in terms of baking, but to be a part of that is a privilege.

Kerry Diamond:
Remind us again how you wound up on The Great British Bake Off. Did your husband sign you up without ... He kind of surprised you and signed you up, if I remember correctly.

Nadiya Hussain:
Well, he kind of just said, "Look, I think you should do this show." Because like all good husbands, he would entertain my need to watch Bake Off. He'd sit there and he'd watch Bake Off with me. But he just put the application in and he said, "Look, you can do almost everything that we see on this show. You do it better, so I just think you should do the show." I said, "Absolutely no way." He badgered me. He did the application, and he said, "I'll do all the boring bits and you'd fill in the necessary bits that I don't know about, and then just do it." I said, "Look, I'm only doing this to humor you." I'm now traveling around New York doing these wonderful things and he's at home with the kids, so I definitely got the last laugh.

Kerry Diamond:
But how sweet and supportive that he said to you, like, "You can do this better than all these people we're watching on television."

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. It's not something that I was used to. I didn't grow up being told, "You're really good at this." Or, "You can achieve something." He was the first person who said, "You know what? Actually you're really good at what you do." It was the first time I'd really experienced any sort of belief outside of my own body. Somebody who actually believed in me, and that was a wonderful thing. I will forever be grateful for that because if he didn't believe in me, I would not have stepped forward even considered going on Bake Off. My life has changed so much since then, so I'm forever grateful. Don't tell him that though. Otherwise, that would be mileage for him forever.

Kerry Diamond:
How are the kids?

Nadiya Hussain:
They're really well. Growing fast. As they grow, my cake baking increases because it seems that they can just sit with three slices of cake and eat it. They're growing and they're wonderful.

Kerry Diamond:
I'm happy to hear that. We're going to talk a little bit more about the GREAT campaign. How can we engage here in the US? I'm slipping this question in. But aside from us, is the whole plan for us to come visit?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. One of the key features of the GREAT campaign, it's very interactive because what they've done is, we've got red phone boxes that are dotted around parts of New York. It will ring occasionally and you can go in, and if you answer the phone, you could win tickets to come and see me do a demonstration. There are loads of other things happening with music and sports throughout the month of March. But in particular, you can actually also come and see me. If you know nothing about British cuisine, it's a little taster of what British cuisine is really like.

Kerry Diamond:
That's so funny. When we walk around, we're going to see phone booths?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah.

Kerry Diamond:
Oh my gosh.

Nadiya Hussain:
There's a phone booth that's moving around New York, and if you see it and it rings, answer it.

Kerry Diamond:
That's very funny. Don't be afraid if it's ringing. I know some people, if you're in the subway, there's still a few phones in the subway. If it started ringing, I think I might-

Nadiya Hussain:
You'd worry.

Kerry Diamond:
... walk away.

Nadiya Hussain:
No, this one you need to. This one, you have to answer.

Kerry Diamond:
Don't just take your photo with the phone booth people if you see it. Answer the phone. Let's talk a little bit more about British cuisine and what it's all about. Rather than ask you to define British food, because I know that's sort of an impossible task, same as asking someone to define American cuisine, I wanted to look at it a different way. If you had to move to the US for a year, what food would you miss the most from back home?

Nadiya Hussain:
Oh my goodness. I would miss cheese.

Kerry Diamond:
We do have cheese here.

Nadiya Hussain:
You do, but it's not the same as the cheese that we have back in the UK. I complain about the rain in the UK, but actually because of the rain, we have amazing pasture. We have beautiful lush, green grass, so we have beautiful cows. We have great meat. But cheese, I would really miss the cheese. But because we've got these amazing cattle, we also have amazing milk and amazing cheese. I would miss that because I think lots of people think cheese France, but actually we do some really amazing. In particular, I'd miss the Wensleydale, which is crumbly and salty sweet.

Kerry Diamond:
I don't even know that cheese. Say that name again.

Nadiya Hussain:
Wensleydale.

Kerry Diamond:
Wensleydale. I love it. Okay. It's sweet salty?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. It's crumbly, so it's not like a cheddar. It crumbles in your hand a little bit and it's a little bit salty and you can infuse it with things like apricots or cranberries or ginger. It's one of those salty sweet kind of cheeses that work really, really well together. That's the one I would miss, for sure.

Kerry Diamond:
How would you serve that? Do you just serve it on crackers? Do you put it in a salad?

Nadiya Hussain:
I usually like my Wensleydale in my apple pie. I will do a delicious short crust pastry, but in the cooked apple, I like to dot little bits of Wensleydale cheese so you get salty, sweet, spicy cinnamon. Perfect combination.

Kerry Diamond:
I love that I asked you one of the most famous bakers in the world. Would you put it on a cracker?

Nadiya Hussain:
I would also eat it.

Kerry Diamond:
Of course you put it in a baked good. That makes all the sense in the world. What else would you miss?

Nadiya Hussain:
Oh goodness. I would probably miss Marmite, which is yeast extract. Which is a byproduct of beer, but it's salty. It's like the Australian version of Vegemite.

Kerry Diamond:
Fanny Singer, who is Alice Waters daughter ... Say that three times fast. Alice Waters daughter sent me a jar of Marmite that I still have in my cabinet that I never opened.

Nadiya Hussain:
Why?

Kerry Diamond:
It might be a year old.

Nadiya Hussain:
It'll be fine.

Kerry Diamond:
It's fine. Because I have no idea what to do with it.

Nadiya Hussain:
Okay. It's great on buttered bread. You have a slice of toast, butter and some Marmite on top. But Marmite has got that umami flavor. It's got depth of flavor and it's wonderful to add to stews. Or if you're doing a bolognese and you need that deep beefy flavor, you add a little bit of that. It's delicious. It's actually really lovely with just boiled pasta and then tossed through boiled pasta, and then you just grate some cheese on top. It's very versatile. It actually works really well with chocolate in some scenarios.

Kerry Diamond:
With chocolate?

Nadiya Hussain:
Because it's salty.

Kerry Diamond:
Would you mix it into a brownie batter or something?

Nadiya Hussain:
You'd mix it into a ganache, and so you get that salty ... You know how salted caramel is a big thing? You could have kind of a deep, rich, dark chocolate with Marmite. It's just perfect.

Kerry Diamond:
Okay. I might start with the toast and the butter.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I wouldn't go straight for the chocolate.

Kerry Diamond:
I'm going to do Marmite 101 first. All right. I'll take a picture and I'll tell you how I do. I'm guessing it's a thin layer of Marmite.

Nadiya Hussain:
A thin layer, yeah. I mean, it depends how much you love it. If it looks like tarmac on the road, it might be too far, but just a thin kind of smattering of it on top of the butter.

Kerry Diamond:
This might be the weirdest question, but what do I do drink with that?

Nadiya Hussain:
What would you drink with that? I mean, I always have it for breakfast, so I always have orange juice. So something sharp.

Kerry Diamond:
So I'll have it for breakfast, maybe with a cup of coffee?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah.

Kerry Diamond:
It sounds like it would go well with coffee. We're going to check this out. What else would you miss? I'm loving this.

Nadiya Hussain:
Oh my goodness. What else would I miss?

Kerry Diamond:
I've learned so much in just-

Nadiya Hussain:
What else?

Kerry Diamond:
... two bites.

Nadiya Hussain:
What else would I miss? We do great salmon, so I think I would miss that. I would really miss that because there's a lovely place around Scotland, the Ullapool, they've got amazing salmon. I think I would miss the salmon because I love fish and fish is one of those things that we grew up eating. I think I'd miss the fish. I think I would miss the fish.

Kerry Diamond:
What's your favorite way to prepare salmon?

Nadiya Hussain:
I like to take a whole side of salmon, take the skin off, crisp the skin up as the salmon's cooking. But for me it's like a really simple kind of garlic, lemon peel oil marinade with some chickpea flour. Then you create a beautiful coating on top and then you let that bake. But that coating it becomes this crisp batter that you eat with the fish. Just some really simple roasted onions, not even potatoes, and then that with the crispy skin on top, delicious.

Kerry Diamond:
That sounds beautiful. When you were describing the kind of coating that you put over it, I was thinking sometimes how they bake fish in salt.

Nadiya Hussain:
On salt.

Kerry Diamond:
But this is something you eat. The salt they just get rid of in the end.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I'm not big on wasting. I hate the idea that you have all that salt and then you have to get rid of it, so I never do. If I ever salt a fish, I keep it so I can spread it on my driveway when it snows. I don't waste anything.

Kerry Diamond:
You are a practical gal. All right. You mentioned that you grew up in a Bangladeshi household in England. I would love to know more about Bangladeshi cuisine. Could you tell us some of the key ingredients and dishes?

Nadiya Hussain:
Because for me, if I was going to say, what is a key ingredient in Bangladesh cuisine? It would have to be fish. We grew up on fish because you have to remember Bangladesh is surrounded by rivers. You're surrounded completely by rivers, so everyone has an abundance of fish. They fish quite a lot. My family fish quite a lot. We've got fish farms as well, so it's a lot of fish, a lot of fruit. Fish and fruit are a combination that work really well together. Again, it's very misunderstood as a cuisine because I think there's Indian cuisine and it gets kind of bunched up with Indian cuisine when actually it's entirely different. It's much spicier. I think some of the key ingredients in Bangladeshi food would be chilis, dried or fresh, coriander, fish and fruit. By fruit, I mean things like oranges and mango and beautiful plum berries that we use that are specific to Bangladesh, and rice. They go through monsoon season, which they need in order to grow rice. Rice would have to be right up there because my granddad was a rice farmer and it's definitely a staple of Bangladeshi food.

Kerry Diamond:
Tell us some ways you like to combine fish and fruit. I know you mentioned some lemon in the salmon, but what's a recipe or preparation where you'd have fish and mango for example?

Nadiya Hussain:
A very simple mango, so you fry the fish with some garlic and then you kind of take the fish out and then you add the mango and you let that cook down. Then it literally turmeric, chili, cook the mango down, put the fish back in, and it's such a simple lightweight of eating fish and fruit. But equally, I've learned to combine fruit in all sorts of dishes, but things like a butternut squash. We love vegetables. We're big on vegetables in Bangladesh. I take a pumpkin or a butternut squash and make a soup, but I would always add the juice and the zest rind of a grapefruit. So you get that tar sweet kind of balance. It's all about balance.

Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. You'll put the rind and the fruit in there, and does it cook down? Do you remove it?

Nadiya Hussain:
You zest. The rind, I wound zest that, so it's quite an intense flavor. Lots of garlic, lots of pumpkin, and you cook that down. Then you've got the juice as well, which gives you a bit of sweetness and you get all that delicious flavor of the grapefruit without any of the bitterness from the pith. There are ways of combining fruit in savory dishes that I love doing.

Kerry Diamond:
Zesting, I think is so underrated. I know chefs love zesting fruit on things, and they've all got their micro planes. But if you are going to eat what's inside and just get rid of the peel, you've gotten rid of so much goodness.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I mean, I have a bowl on my radiator at home whenever I've peeled an orange or I've got some orange peel leftover, I just leave it on the radiator on the bowl. It sits in the bowl and over the weeks it just dries and it just sits there. Then I might blend that into a powder and put it into cake or blend that and use it in my-

Kerry Diamond:
That's genius.

Nadiya Hussain:
... soups or use it in my curries. Because things like, if I'm making a stew, star anise and orange peel, just lift it, take it to a whole other level. There are so many ways of using it. You can even kind of blitz it, add some gold luster dust and create this orange gorgeous stuff. There are so many ways of using fruit.

Kerry Diamond:
I am obsessed with clementines. I eat my body weight in clementines over the winter, but I do get rid of those beautiful peels.

Nadiya Hussain:
Never.

Kerry Diamond:
I should dry them-

Nadiya Hussain:
Dry them.

Kerry Diamond:
... and blitz them.

Nadiya Hussain:
Just blitz them and then you can add them to cake. You can add them to icing if you want orange flavored icing.

Kerry Diamond:
I mean, anything, yogurt, anything.

Nadiya Hussain:
Literally anything. A little sprinkle on your breakfast porridge in the morning. It's just never throw them away. You are going to be an avid peeler collector now, aren't you?

Kerry Diamond:
I labeling my jars. I'm going to call it my Nadiya powder. I think I'm going to give it a nickname. You mentioned porridge, another British thing that we don't necessarily ... We kind of do eat it here, but we call it something different.

Nadiya Hussain:
What do you call it?

Kerry Diamond:
Oatmeal.

Nadiya Hussain:
Okay. Yeah.

Kerry Diamond:
Tell us how you make porridge.

Nadiya Hussain:
I make it the way my dad likes to make it. My loves porridge. It's not always been my favorite thing to eat, but it's just one of those things when you're a child and you're forced to eat something, you're like, "Actually I don't like this." But then you get older and you really appreciate the things you disliked as children. I cook my porridge with water, just a water porridge. Very simple. Then I always like to add a bit of cooked fruit on top. Whether that's for me, my favorite stewed pears and fennel. Which is such a delicious combination with whole fennel seeds. My kids on the other hand will put a few dollops of Nutella.

Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. I was going to say mom's version is much fancier. I throw some frozen blueberries in there and it's perfect. And a little milk sometimes.

Nadiya Hussain:
Maybe orange powder.

Kerry Diamond:
I'm going to add my secret Nadiya powder. Back to Bangladeshi cuisine for a second. In terms of restaurants, is there a Bangladeshi restaurant community?

Nadiya Hussain:
A lot of Indian restaurants in the UK, they're owned by Indian people, but they're run by Bangladeshis. Quite often, you'll go in and I mean, nine times out of 10, I've gone into a restaurant and I can speak the language because they know I'm Bengali and we go in and they're like, we can fully have a conversation. These restaurants sometimes are not owned by them, but they are run by Bangladeshis. Front of house, back of house, run by Bangladeshis. You can usually tell when you go in and the menu has a few kind of keywords. Like it might have something like…, which means fish. Or it might have…, which means spicy. There're certain words that you'll read and be like, "Ah."

Kerry Diamond:
A few little menu clues.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. You can tell that. Or they might put something like…, which is a seven segmented lime that you can only get from Bangladesh. When you see those keywords, you're like, "Okay, this is a Bangladeshi run restaurant." Which is exactly what my dad run. My entire life, my dad ran Indian restaurants. But the recipes, things like tikka masala, he had all the kind of classics comma tikka masala on there. He never actually cooked Bangladeshi food. I wish that he had. I wish he had the strength to be able to say, "I'm stripping this menu and I'm going to put just Bangladeshi food on here." Actually, he never did and he just thought that UK wasn't ready for that kind of food. But I get to work in the industry now where I get to share those recipes with people because I am really proud of them. I'm really proud of how delicious they are and how easy they are. Whenever I write a recipe that's Bangladesh, I will show my dad. It's quite a proud moment for me whenever I do.

Kerry Diamond:
We talked about your dad a lot the last time we spoke. He worked so hard.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. He was a hard worker, so he spent a lot of time kind of ... They're just grafters. They work really hard. My uncles, every one of them, they've all worked really hard to be where they are today and to be sort of semi comfortable. I think definitely learned my work ethic from my family because they've always had to work 10 times harder than their peers or the people around them.

Kerry Diamond:
Were you considered one of the good cooks or bakers in the family?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah.

Kerry Diamond:
So they weren't surprised by the success on-

Nadiya Hussain:
No.

Kerry Diamond:
... The Great British Bake Off.

Nadiya Hussain:
I'm the only one that bakes. My second sisters just started to bake, so it's nice. I think for them, the novelty of having one child that bakes it's nice because I'm the only one that does it. But everybody in my family are amazing cooks. My brothers are really good cooks.

Kerry Diamond:
Wow. You're lucky.

Nadiya Hussain:
Really good cooks.

Kerry Diamond:
Okay. Let's talk some destinations. London gets so much love. What's an interesting food destination in the UK that gets overlooked or that maybe most Americans wouldn't know about?

Nadiya Hussain:
I think one place that everybody should visit if you get into London is Borough Market. Because Borough Market is literally the heart of all kind of really good food. It changes from season to season. It changes all the time. The restaurants around it change all the time. There's a stall there that's always stocked up with the best spices that has always been there. I don't remember it not being there, but you can eat from every corner of the world in Borough Market. Whether it's Mauritian food, West Indian food, there are people out there who are cooking delicious ... There's a Syrian stall out there cooking the most delicious food. There's so much variation in terms of what you can eat, but also what you can buy. There are great cheese stalls, lots alcohol. I know if you drink, I don't, but I always kind of steer away from that, but there are great kind of ... Donuts, some of the most amazing donuts. You name it.

Kerry Diamond:
You're in New York for a little while. What is on your must try food list while you're here?

Nadiya Hussain:
Well, whenever I go somewhere, my kids are always like, "Mom, you've got to try this. Mom, you've got to try that." My kid said, "You can't go to New York and not eat a bagel." I was like-

Kerry Diamond:
Wait. You've never had a bagel?

Nadiya Hussain:
I have had a bagel. But they said, "If you're going to eat a bagel, you've got to eat it in New York with salt, beef and mustard. That's what you've got to have." That's what I'm looking for right now.

Kerry Diamond:
You're going to eat some bagels. Anything else on the list or places you want to visit that are connected to food?

Nadiya Hussain:
I still haven't got my chops around any cheesecake, which would be nice. That would be nice. I'm trying to think what else I would like to eat. Because whenever I think New York, whenever I think about food, I think of Man v. Food where he just sits there and eats loads of food. That kind of almost puts me off a little bit.

Kerry Diamond:
I don't think I've ever even seen that show.

Nadiya Hussain:
Have you not?

Kerry Diamond:
No.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I have lots. My kids love it.

Kerry Diamond:
Oh no.

Nadiya Hussain:
But cheesecake, I want to find some good cheesecake.

Kerry Diamond:
Cheesecake. I've got to think about that. Okay.

Nadiya Hussain:
But what do you recommend?

Kerry Diamond:
First thing that comes to mind is Junior's. That's sort of a classic cheesecake place in Brooklyn. I don't know if it's the best cheesecake anymore. There are a lot of popups happening. Is that going on in the UK?

Nadiya Hussain:
A lot. Yes. A lot of that. Because I think people are so much more open to ... When I think back to when I was a teenager and I would fight my dad to feed people actual Bangladeshi food, I think perception has changed. I think people are so much more willing to try, have an open mind. I think also over the last two years, because of the pandemic, people haven't been able to travel, so food is a really wonderful way to transport you into a world that you don't know anything about. I said, "Well, for me, that's why I love food." Is because you can really transport people to places that they've never been. Food has the ability to do that. That's why I think popups and supper clubs are really, really popular because you get to enjoy a cuisine at its best.

Kerry Diamond:
I also think, we've actually talked about this on the past few episodes of the radio show, it's also a reaction to what happened to restaurants over the past few years. A lot of chefs losing their jobs. A lot of pastry chefs lost their jobs. They don't necessarily want to go back to restaurants, so they're kind of doing things their own way and doing popups and guest chef dinners, and, like you said, supper clubs.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I suppose it's a new way of living that is safer in some ways. But we get to reap the rewards of that. If there are all these amazing popup shops coming up and you can try foods at supper clubs that you would never have tried before, why not? Why not take advantage of it?

Kerry Diamond:
I wish she were here the other weekend. I dragged my goddaughter around, but there was a pizza popup. There was a Vietnamese dessert popup. We did a donut box with all the women who had been on our cover. I have to get an issue to you, but we did five different covers. Each of the women collaborated on a donut and Fan-Fan Doughnuts in Brooklyn, did a box with all their donuts and it was just so much fun. But there's a lot going on and it's a good moment if you love food. Speaking of American cuisines and a good moment for American cuisine, you know a fair amount about American cuisine because you did a show for the BBC on American cuisine and you visited California and the south. It was specifically to see the impact migrants have had on American food. I'm just curious, how did the show come about?

Nadiya Hussain:
It was my curiosity. A lot of the things that I do stem from my own curiosity because I'm fascinated in immigration. Because as a first generation Brit, for me, immigration has played such a big part of my life. Whether that's education, whether that's food, whatever. You name it, it's played a huge part in my life. As I've become older and explored more and been a little bit more brave to be able to ask the questions and to be curious, being curious is something very new to me. I've always been curious, but I suppose I've never been able to explore that curiosity. When I said that I really want to do this show and I want to visit parts of America that have the highest levels of immigration, because I truly do believe that immigration, wherever there's high levels of immigration, you are going to get amazing food.

Also really interesting people with interesting stories. I was in a night market in LA, which you would never know. When you drive around the corner, and there's this night market. There are mostly women cooking out of shopping trolleys who have come from extraordinary circumstances, difficult ones as well. It was the first time I'd tried a pupusa, which is like this dense pancake type thing that is cooked in oil. It's just filling and delicious. That's literally all she made, was vegetable pupusas and chicken pupusas, and that was it. She spent the whole night cooking those. She was happy and smiling and everybody there, there was this comradery and there was this kind of ... It was infectious, the atmosphere. You wouldn't get that anywhere else. Again, UK's pretty similar in that immigration has definitely shaped its food landscape in a way that is forever changing. For me, that curiosity led me there. I'm so glad I went because I had some amazing food.

Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. Tell us what you had.

Nadiya Hussain:
I had beignets, which was one of the things that my kids ... At the French Quarter in Louisiana.

Kerry Diamond:
Did you get covered with powdered sugar?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yes, of course I did. Of course I did. All over my face, all over my mouth. But they were delicious and sweet and the queues were long to get in. They're obviously very, very popular. That was incredible.

Kerry Diamond:
Any other dishes that were a surprise to you?

Nadiya Hussain:
It was all about tacos. There are tacos everywhere, but what I hadn't realized was that we get tacos at home and you can buy the shell, but they're really just not as nice as the stuff that you get on the stores or in the restaurants. But literally you can put anything in a taco. I had this delicious prawn taco that is deep fried. Anything deep fried, I'm in for. I love deep fried. Then it was covered with the delicious kind of green salsa. I loved the salsas while I was in LA. It was just like I tried to pick up bottles everywhere. But the tacos, amazing.

Kerry Diamond:
I love all the different American experiences you've had. You've been to LA now. You've been to the south. You've been to New York. You've been to Disney World.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. Catfish as well in Louisiana was incredible. The tastiest catfish. I helped her fish and I was in the bayous and there were lots of frogs. It was amazing. It was such a wonderful experience.

Kerry Diamond:
Let's jump ahead because you have been so busy. I do not know how you do everything that you do. We last spoke November 2020, and since then you've got a lot of things since then, but you've got a new cookbook and a new TV show, Fast Flavours. Tell us what Fast Flavours is all about.

Nadiya Hussain:
Fast Flavours is all about-

Kerry Diamond:
That's flavor with a U for those keeping track. Yes.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yes.

Kerry Diamond:
The British spelling.

Nadiya Hussain:
Fast Flavours is all about the recipes that I love. But every recipe is about taking the ingredients that you have in a simple recipe, but enhancing that flavor. Whether that's toasting your spices before cooking with them. Whether that's toasting your coconut. Whether that's drying something. Whether that's frying something, you name it. Like browning flour before you cook it. All of those kind of tips to get maximum flavor. That's what the book is all about. It is just like all my other books, great recipes, delicious recipes. But it's just a helping hand to make sure you use the ingredients really well to get maximum flavor.

Kerry Diamond:
I love it. Like what we talked about with the citrus rinds?

Nadiya Hussain:
Exactly. Things like onions, I think sometimes people don't realize that they don't cook their onions enough, so they don't really add ... An onion is the base to any good dish and we just do not give them enough respect. If you cook them slow and low and get them golden delicious, that is going to transform the flavor of your dish and it's worth taking that time. I-

Kerry Diamond:
You almost don't have to do anything-

Nadiya Hussain:
Not really.

Kerry Diamond:
... to them. You can just put it on, set your timer because you might even forget they're there.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. Just literally cook them gently on a low heat and just come in and out occasionally, drift in and out and give them a stir. That's it. Little things like that really can make you a confident cook.

Kerry Diamond:
Tell us one recipe you love from the book and why.

Nadiya Hussain:
One of my favorite recipes would have to be probably the Bombay burgers, which the clues in the name. The Bombay burger is made-

Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. You had me before you even described it.

Nadiya Hussain:
No, let me describe it. Now I'm going to have you. This is it. Now I've got you. Bombay burgers are made out of Bombay mix. Have you ever had Bombay mix before? Which is, it's fried noodles that are spiced and they usually serve them at Indian restaurants. You can buy them from the Indian aisle or the world aisle at the supermarket. It's basically noodles that are deep fried and they're mixed with peas and peanuts and spices and fried lentils. Now-

Kerry Diamond:
I think I've had that. I don't think I knew it was called that.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. It's called Bombay mix. You get lots of variations of Bombay mix, thin noodles, thick noodles, loads of variations. But that is already packed with flavor and those noodles are made out of chickpeas. So you've got the carbohydrates, you've got all of the flavor. Essentially all I do is add hot water to it and rehydrate it, add a few more spices, a little bit more flavor and turn them into patties. Then you just grill them and they are absolutely delicious. For anyone who wants to make the best veggie burger, that's the one.

Kerry Diamond:
I love that. Then what do you do with it? You do that. You grill it. What are your ultimate toppings, bun, all of that?

Nadiya Hussain:
You grill it and then you add with that, while you are grilling that, while you bake those in the oven, you also slice up some onions and bake them with a little bit of oil and seasoning. Then you get the caramelized onions because you can't have a burger without caramelized onions. I always go for a brioche bun, mayonnaise, patty, melted cheese on top, fried onions and then mango pickle on top. You're going to go all out. You've got the creaminess of-

Kerry Diamond:
I'm so hungry. It's lunch time. I didn't eat anything, and this is killing me. That sounds delicious. That recipe is in Fast Flavours?

Nadiya Hussain:
It is. Yeah.

Kerry Diamond:
Great. Speaking of books, you have so many books now. There is a whole Nadiya Hussain library out there. If you don't own any of Nadiya's books, there is an entire library waiting to be discovered. How many books do you have in total today?

Nadiya Hussain:
In total, including cookbooks, fiction, nonfiction, I have 17 books.

Kerry Diamond:
I have to say congratulations.

Nadiya Hussain:
Thank you.

Kerry Diamond:
As a child, I feel like books saved me. I loved books. I loved the library. I loved those kind librarians.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I mean writing is such a big part of my life. I love writing, whether that's recipes or poetry or fiction, non-fiction, children, all the different ... There're so many genres that I've kind of stepped into, and writing is one of the things that I find most comfort in. For people to be able to buy my books and whether that's a recipe or reading something, to find comfort in that makes me feel really happy because I know as a child, if I didn't have books to read, I'd be very lost. I fell the escapism that you feel when you read a book. Cookbooks are good nighttime reading. I know lots of people who take cookbooks up to bed with them and read them at night I love writing, so I will be doing this for as long as I possibly can.

Kerry Diamond:
Did you always know you were a good writer or is this a skill you developed later.

Nadiya Hussain:
No, I've always been a good writer.

Kerry Diamond:
You've always been a good writer.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I've always written poetry monologues.

Kerry Diamond:
The one book you don't have yet, a poetry book.

Nadiya Hussain:
No, I haven't, but I tell you now I have a wealth of poetry that just sits there and it's never seen the light of day. But it's all a part of kind of my managing anxiety and making sure that I'm kind of keeping check on myself. I find writing poetry really helps me with that. Then of course I write for a living and I write cookbooks and fiction and nonfiction, so I'm always busy. Whether that's work or not, I'm always writing something.

Kerry Diamond:
Did you think you might be an author one day when you were younger?

Nadiya Hussain:
No. Never. I was just good at it. I was just good at it and I used it as to find calm and I never imagined that I would ever become an author. The first thing I ever published was a cookbook. But if you read the book and the introductions, there is a sentimentality and there is a nostalgia in the way I write. I love that. I love that somebody can pick up my book and might even do a recipe and just read a little bit of the introduction and say, "You know what? I get where she's coming from." That's wonderful.

Kerry Diamond:
That is one thing I love about British cookbooks, is that they're definitely more writerly than American cookbooks. I mean, I love when a new Nigella book comes out because it's just-

Nadiya Hussain:
It's whimsical. It is.

Kerry Diamond:
It's whimsical. I have to break out my dictionary. The essays are amazing. Here in America, if you write your head note longer than 100 words, your publisher is like, "No, no, no, no, no. You can't have a long headnote."

Nadiya Hussain:
The same with sort of Nigel Slater. He write-

Kerry Diamond:
Right. Nigel.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. He writes some amazing books and they are beautiful books that you go back to time and time again. I love the way we write.

Kerry Diamond:
I mean, you've got 17 books. It's really hard to single out one, but is there one that's very special to you?

Nadiya Hussain:
I think my first cookbook is very special to me because it's one of the things that I'd done after I'd come off Bake Off thinking, firstly, why would anyone want to publish my book? Secondly, who is going to buy it?

Kerry Diamond:
Wait, you thought this after you won?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. Every book is a labor of love, but that was my first ever book.

Kerry Diamond:
Even having won this baking show you still thought you would struggle to find an audience?

Nadiya Hussain:
Absolutely. I suppose because I've never really seen anyone like myself on television. So to think that there's an audience out there who would want to buy my books or listen to me or watch my shows, it was unfathomable. It wasn't something that I could ever have dreamt up. I think if I was going to pick a book, it's probably my first book, Nadiya’s Kitchen, just because it means so much to me because it was the only book I thought I was ever going to write. But I love them all. I love them all like my children.

Kerry Diamond:
Speaking of children, the children's books, you mentioned representation and not having seen people like you on television. That's one of the very beautiful things about your children's books.

Nadiya Hussain:
Yeah. I think whether that's a image of a child or whether that's a name, whether that's a scenario, whether it's a festival, you name it, whenever I'm writing these stories, I'm always consciously thinking of, am I including everybody here? If my kids pick up this book or my nephews and nieces pick up, will they recognize themselves in one of these pages? Whether that's a name, whether that's a face. I'm always really conscious of that, and that's something that has to change in publishing. That's something that can't change unless we make those changes. When I sit down and we talk about what's going in the book, for me, it's really important to have variation and diversity so everybody feels represented.

Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. Well, congratulations on that. They're in multiple languages too, I saw. Congrats. They're all over the world and it's a beautiful thing. I don't know if you know this about Cherry Bombe, but lot of women in the Cherry Bombe community are small business owners. They're entrepreneurs. They want to be entrepreneurs. Since you won The Great British Bake Off, you've had to build and manage a personal brand. Which is a whole thing-

Nadiya Hussain:
It's a whole other thing. Yeah.

Kerry Diamond:
.... unto itself. What do you wish you knew then that you know now?

Nadiya Hussain:
I don't know how to answer that, but I think there's one thing that I always tell myself as a brand and as a person who ... I suppose for me, I don't have a 9:00 to 5:00. It's freelance. It's I work when work comes in and I'm so busy. But one thing that I've really, really taken after kind of starting my career was, one of the things I'd wish I'd done more of as a child was sleep on it. That's the advice I would give to everybody. It's very easy to make a wrong decision in the light of day. Genuinely, I do believe that when you go to bed and you sleep on it, you wake up with a different perspective. I think that's why I've been able to make such good decisions up to now. Because there are moments where I'm like, I will make a decision and it feels rash and it feels like not the right thing to do. My advice to anyone who is running a small business or is a sole person relying on themselves, sleep on it. Always sleep on it.

Kerry Diamond:
Any tips for how you organize-

Nadiya Hussain:
How I organize?

Kerry Diamond:
... this empire? Yes.

Nadiya Hussain:
For me, it's about having a network. A really good network of people around you. Because although the empire is mine alone, I wouldn't be able to do it if I didn't have a great support network. I'm not good at delegating. I'm very bad at that because I want to do everything myself. Delegate. If you have to be away for a few days, find somebody who will look after the kids or somebody who will cook for you. Or cook in advance, put it in the freezer, you name it. All of those things, delegate. That really helps because I think also as women, I think we want to be able to do everything ourselves because we feel this responsibility that we have to be able to carry and shoulder every burden. That actually that's not important. Delegate. I think because I'm better at doing that now, I am able to concentrate on my craft and concentrate on being really good at what I'm good at.

Kerry Diamond:
We're going to do a little speed round. Coffee, tea, or something else?

Nadiya Hussain:
Tea.

Kerry Diamond:
What's your favorite kind of tea?

Nadiya Hussain:
Builder's tea. A strong black tea with sugar and a splash of milk. That is my drink of choice.

Kerry Diamond:
I love that it's called builder's tea. This might be a tough one because you probably have a lot of cookbooks. You've written a lot of cookbooks. Tell us a treasured cookbook in your collection.

Nadiya Hussain:
I've got this book from when I was 16 when I started to kind of dabble in baking and it's called Baking Classics. I don't think it even has an author name on it. It's just Baking Classics. I would love to give you a name of a celebrity chef or cook that's got a book, but this has been the book that I've gone back to time and time again. It's the thing that taught me how to make a really good madeira, a really good poundcake, a really good fruitcake, a really good génoise sponge. It has all the basics.

Kerry Diamond:
I love it. It's where it all started. It's like the Narnia closet or something. Right?

Nadiya Hussain:
It's old and tatty and very thin and it's stuck together. My kids love that book because they get all of their basics from that book.

Kerry Diamond:
This just popped in my head, but I feel like Nadiya and the magical cookbook and the cookbook opens and all these magical things pop out of the-

Nadiya Hussain:
Out comes the magic.

Kerry Diamond:
... cookbook. Exactly. Then you find out at the end that the magic was inside you all along.

Nadiya Hussain:
Nice. Beautiful narrative.

Kerry Diamond:
Thank you. Last pantry purchase?

Nadiya Hussain:
I did a shop before I came here, but the one thing that I'd run out of, which why has a baker run out of butter? But I have variations of butter, so I'll buy unsalted, I'll buy salted, I'll buy spreadable, I'll buy vegan, I'll buy a little bit of everything, margarine. I have a little bit of everything. You never know. You could have a butter emergency, so I have a lot of butter at home.

Kerry Diamond:
Now we know to run to your house when the butter emergency does come. What is your most used kitchen tool?

Nadiya Hussain:
My most used kitchen tool would be my knife. I use it to smash cloves. I use it to chop chocolate. I use it to chop up onions.

Kerry Diamond:
Is it a big chef's knife?

Nadiya Hussain:
It's a big, Santoku beautiful knife.

Kerry Diamond:
Knife. What is a song that makes you smile?

Nadiya Hussain:
Blackbird by The Beatles. Beatles, love them. But Blackbird is the song that my dad used to listen to on his record player while we were upstairs. I used to always hear it through the floor. For me, whenever I listened to it, I always turn the song on in one room and I go to another room, because it makes me feel like my dad's in the other room. I just love that song.

Kerry Diamond:
That's so beautiful. Have you met Mary McCartney, Paul's daughter?

Nadiya Hussain:
No, I haven't.

Kerry Diamond:
She has a cooking show. She was on Radio Cherry Bombe a few months ago and like you-

Nadiya Hussain:
Never met her.

Kerry Diamond:
... one of the nicest people I've ever interviewed. Maybe you two will cook together one day. Dream travel destination.

Nadiya Hussain:
Peru. Machu Picchu.

Kerry Diamond:
Because?

Nadiya Hussain:
I want to climb Machu. I've never done a mountain before. I've climbed many a metaphorical mountain, but never an actual mountain. But I would love to climb Machu Picchu.

Kerry Diamond:
If you had to be trapped on a desert island with one food celebrity, who would it be and why?

Nadiya Hussain:
Duff Goldman.

Kerry Diamond:
Duff Goldman?

Nadiya Hussain:
Yes.

Kerry Diamond:
I would not have predicted that answer. Tell us why.

Nadiya Hussain:
Because he's lovely and he's fun. I fear meeting people that I really like on television because I don't want to be disappointed. I don't want him to turn out to be a horrible person, but I love him. I remember being addicted to his shows when I was baking cake at home with the kids. Because the fact that he's got this amazing bakery and they do these amazing extravagant, huge bakes that they somehow transport, and I always have my heart in my throat whenever he's trying to bake. I love him. I think he's great. He's just got really, really sunny vibe about him. I think we'd make great cake together.

Kerry Diamond:
Nadiya Hussain, that's it. What a pleasure to meet you in person, finally.

Nadiya Hussain:
Amazing. Thank you so much.

Kerry Diamond:
That's it for today's show. Thank you so much to Nadiya Hussain for joining me today. To learn more about the GREAT Calling campaign, visit GREATcampaign.com. You could pick up Nadiya's books at your favorite local bookstore. Thank you to Kerrygold and Foxtrot for supporting Radio Cherry Bombe. If you haven't tried Kerrygold yet, be sure to look for it in your next visit to your favorite grocery store. Foxtrot, I want you all if you have a brand to apply for the UP & COMERS Awards. Check our show notes for the link. The deadline is April 4th. Don't forget to check out our website, cherrybombe.com for Jubilee updates. Radio Cherry Bombe is a production of Cherry Bombe magazine. Our theme song is by the band Tra La La. Thank you, Joseph Hazan, studio engineer for Newsstand Studios and thank you to our assistant producer, Jenna Sadhu. Thanks to you for listening. You are the bombe.