Evie McGee Colbert Transcript
Kerry Diamond:
Hi, everyone. You're listening to Radio Cherry Bombe, and I'm your host, Kerry Diamond. I'm the founder and editor of Cherry Bombe Magazine.
On today's show, I'm talking with Evie McGee Colbert, co-author of the brand new book, “Does This Taste Funny? Recipes Our Family Loves,” which she co-wrote with her husband, Stephen Colbert, who you all know from “The Late Show.” Evie is also the co-founder of the Spartina Industries production company and a founder of Montclair Film, the arts nonprofit in Montclair, New Jersey. This year's festival kicks off on October 18th. Evie and I cover a lot of ground from the influence of her late mother Patti, to the city of Charleston where Evie and Stephen are from, to her big family life. And of course, we talk about recipes. Stay tuned for our chat.
A little housekeeping. Be sure to check out the events calendar on cherrybombe.com. We've got a lot going on and would love to see you in one of the cities where we're hosting events. There's Jessie Sheehan's Cookbook Tour. Jessie, of course, is the host of our baking pod, She's My Cherry Pie, and is headed to New York, San Francisco, Chicago, and Boston. There's Jubilee 2025 in Manhattan next year, and this October's Jubilee Wine Country in Calistoga, California. You can find tickets and all the details on cherrybombe.com.
Now let's check in with today's guest.
Kerry Diamond:
Evie McGee Colbert, welcome to Radio Cherry Bombe.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Thank you so much. I'm delighted to be here.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, well, we're delighted to have you. I was so excited when I found out you two did a cookbook.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, we were, too.
Kerry Diamond:
How did that come about?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, I think Stephen had been approached to do a cookbook before COVID. He was like, "No, I don't have time." He doesn't think of himself as a cook, although he is a great cook. And then during COVID, we had to cook all the time. We weren't going out to eat, and we reexamined it and thought maybe this would be something fun to do together. It came out of COVID and then my being involved with his show, I think Celadon thought, okay, the two of you together is a thing now. So that's how it came about really.
Kerry Diamond:
You have a husband who does a late night TV show. That must be tough on family life.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It was. The good part of it is he doesn't travel. I suppose if he was a movie star, he'd go somewhere for weeks.
Kerry Diamond:
That could be next.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, I don't know. But as close to nine to five as you can get in this industry. However, it wasn't nine to five, it was more like eight to 9:30 at night. So when the kids were little, there wasn't really family supper or dinner, but he was home and weekends he was home. It was a little challenging. It's a consuming job and a consuming career so we didn't have as much leisure time as perhaps one might've wanted.
Kerry Diamond:
So the pandemic happens?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
All of a sudden he's home all the time.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Right.
Kerry Diamond:
Was it tough having him underfoot?
Evie McGee Colbert:
That's a really funny question.
Kerry Diamond:
Sorry Stephen.
Evie McGee Colbert:
When he did “The Colbert Report” I said to him pretty early on, that character you're playing does not come home. And there'd be maybe once or twice when he'd come in and I'd be like, "Go back out and come back in. No bossiness. Stop it. Stop it with the know-it-all." That has always been our thing. When you come home, you're a dad and a husband and you're not a boss anymore. But I was a little afraid of working together because he is used to being the boss, that I think was so much easier than either one of us expected. We collaborated in a way that was wonderful.
Kerry Diamond:
Explain to people what you mean by we worked together because he literally was recording the show from a spare bedroom.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Exactly. So in March of '20 when the world changed overnight or over a couple of days or something, we decided to go to our house on Sullivan's Island, South Carolina. There were a couple of reasons. One is that both my parents were elderly and I wanted to be there to see them. My sister lives across the street, so they weren't without help, but it was so scary back then and I thought, I need to be there. Our three children came with us. We all went down to our house and then just two people I think helped set up one of the rooms for the show. It involved a lot of wires, a lot of laptops, a couple of cameras, a lot of headphones. And it was funny, I was showing someone yesterday a video I took, it was so messy because I looked at the floor and I said, "Do all these wires need to be like this? Couldn't they be coiled?" But no, no, it was a mess.
It was actually really funny because you don't know what you have to do until you have to do it. And you don't know how to do it until you have to do it. And here we were faced with this dilemma. So we did it and it was actually lovely. Our son, Peter, who was a film major at Northwestern at the time, he was a senior, he was great. He got everything up and running. He could talk the language. He knew what needed to be done. Eventually he said to us, I'm not going to graduate from college if I keep doing this. So he's like, "I'm out. I got to finish my classes." And then our next son, John, who is at the time, a high school senior, he took over and then eventually he said, "Yeah, I may not graduate from high school if I don't go back to some of these classes." Although he had senioritis in the biggest way.
So eventually they went their ways and I was left to do this job. And the first thing I did, I said to Stephen's crew who are all at their own homes in New York and New Jersey, I said, "I need someone to send me steps, like written instructions. I know the boys, they're young, they remember things. I need step one, turn on the lights. I need step two, open the door." And so every day I would have this little sheet and I would be like, "Turn this on, turn that on." Once you know how to do it it's not so intimidating after a while. It's fun.
Kerry Diamond:
It's so interesting. So you were basically doing everything we see in the movies in the control room?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah. All of it. And then one day Stephen said, “We have this thing called First Drafts, and we usually ask someone in the audience to do it, but there is no audience. Would you be willing to do it as a guest?" So I was like, "Oh, sure. That sounds like fun." I'll never forget. That day it was really funny. It was July, hot, and I've already turned everything on and I'm getting it set up. And then someone on the headset says, "Evie, we've changed the order. We're going to do your thing now." And I'm like, "I haven't even showered." So I run upstairs and brush my hair and put on some red something. I don't know. Just something I had in my closet and threw on lipstick and sat down on a stool. And I was like, "Hi." And I said to him later, I'm like, "I think I am the only person you've ever had who's like your stage manager, your crew operator, and your guest." So yeah, it was a lot of hats.
Kerry Diamond:
There were a lot of firsts back then.
Evie McGee Colbert:
A lot of firsts.
Kerry Diamond:
Another first is all of a sudden you're having dinner together every night.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Correct. Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
At a decent time.
Evie McGee Colbert:
At a decent time. And our daughter, who's our oldest, and she was already out of college and working, she was also funny. She said, "Listen, I'm not going back in terms of relationship. I'm looking at this as if we're roommates, and that means everyone has a task and a chore and everyone has a night for a meal." So we are like, "Sure. That sounds great." And what was funny about it is she was already cooking, so she would make something every night. Stephen would make something every night. And the two boys, Peter did, but our youngest was a high school senior and so again, he had senioritis. I think one time he said to his band leader over Zoom, “I'm supposed to make family dinner tonight, what can I make?” He came downstairs. He was like, "We're going to make rice balls." And I'm like, "I've never made that. How are we going to make that?" So that was fun. We explored recipes together. And yes, we ate as a family every night, which we hadn't done in so long.
Kerry Diamond:
It must've been magical.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It was really wonderful. It was a scary time and a very difficult time for so many people, but there were silver linings for our family for sure.
Kerry Diamond:
We'll be right back with today's guest. The fall issue of Cherry Bombe’s print magazine is dropping very soon. It's all about the creative class. We're highlighting some of the most innovative and imaginative folks in and around the food world, from photographers to pastry chefs. I would love for you to subscribe to our magazine. It's one of the most beautiful ones around. It's thick and lush and filled with stories, recipes, and beautiful photos. We print the magazine at Meridian, a family owned printing press in Rhode Island. The cut-off date to subscribe and receive the fall issue is Sunday, September 22nd so don't delay. Subscribe and get four issues delivered direct to your door and free shipping. Head to cherrybombe.com for more.
Jessie Sheehan:
Hi, peeps. It's Jessie Sheehan, the host of She's my Cherry Pie, the baking podcast from The Cherry Bombe Podcast Network. I have big news for you. My new cookbook, “Salty, Cheesy, Herby, Crispy Snackable Bakes” will be available on Tuesday, September 24th. This is my first savory baking book, and I'm so excited to share it with all of you. It features a hundred easy-peasy baking recipes for breakfast, lunch, dinner, and of course snacking. From sage butter scones, to smash burger hand pies, and tomato za'atar galette. You'll also find six of my essential savory baking hacks, including how to make my magic melted butter pie dough and the quickest and easiest caramelized onions. I just announced my cookbook tour and tickets are on sale right now at cherrybombe.com. The launch party will take place in Manhattan on Tuesday, September 24th. Then I'm in San Francisco on Tuesday, October 8th, Chicago on Tuesday, October 15th, and Boston on Wednesday, October 23rd and I can't wait to see you. Thank you to Kerrygold and King Arthur Flour for supporting my tour. You can also click the link in the show notes of this episode to pre-order the book now or pick up a copy at your favorite local bookstore starting September 24th. I hope you love “Salty, Cheesy, Herby, Crispy, Snackable Bakes.” As much as I loved writing it.
Kerry Diamond:
Let's talk about this cookbook.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Sure.
Kerry Diamond:
Great title.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Thank you.
Kerry Diamond:
How did that come about?
Evie McGee Colbert:
It's funny. I think Stephen had brainstormed that, and when we were talking with Jamie Raab our publisher about titles, she reminded him. She said, "Well, months ago you had said, 'Does This Taste Funny?' I think that's great." And we both had forgotten. And we said, "Well, yeah, that does sound good. Maybe we'll go with that." So it was his idea, but we forgot about it for a while. So I'm glad someone was writing it down.
Kerry Diamond:
It's a great title. And it's funny. You read it and you can't help but laugh. Tell us how the process was, because cookbooks are not easy.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It was years. Neither one of us knew what this would be like. It was an adventure, and we were both excited to do it together and to start on this adventure. But I think we both expected, we'll just give him some recipes and be done with it. But boy, it's so much more detailed than that. The first thing we did, which was really smart, is we hired my niece, Lucy Wichmann, my sister's daughter, who is a wonderful cook. But she's also young and organized. And so she set up an Excel spreadsheet and I would just literally email her scraps of paper and she'd turn them into legitimate recipes. And then sometimes she'd say, "It's too old, and I don't think you wanted your cookbook." I'd be like, "You're right." We set a rule, nothing off the back of a box so that eliminated a lot of things that we'd probably cook.
And then we also reached out to family, so that's why there's so many family recipes in there because we said, we're doing this. My sister-in-law, Kitty, I had been making her swordfish dish for years for the kids, but I said, "Kitty, it's your recipe. You send it to me the way you do it. I want it to be your recipe. It's not my recipe." So that was a lot of what we did is involve a lot of other people, which was really fun. But the testing is so complicated. Lucy tested every recipe, but then we also hired Chris Styler, a cookbook producer and wonderful person. Chris went over every single recipe several times, tested it. He would also be the one to say, "Maybe you need to tell people exactly how to do this so they don't burn their hand." Little things that we wouldn't think about to make a cookbook, both safe and informative
Kerry Diamond:
And engaging the senses. That's another thing they do in cookbooks that you don't necessarily realize, like learning something is done based on how it smells, texture, sight.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Totally. That's so interesting you say that because there's so many things that I would just know by smell. Like the banana bread, I've been making it forever. I didn't know how long I cooked it. I would just smell when it smelled right. There were definitely things you had to make normal or readable for other people.
Kerry Diamond:
It is tough when you have lots of cooks in the kitchen, so to say, with the recipe development, because everyone writes a recipe differently.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Right. Lucy, God, love her, said to us very early on, "What form do we want?" And we like, "What do you mean?" She said, "What recipe form? There are lots of different forms. Which one should we use?" We're like, "Oh, I don't know. Let's pick one." And then she would do that. She would put everything in the same form, which was a lot of work. She did a lot of work for us, which was great.
Kerry Diamond:
What's Lucy doing now?
Evie McGee Colbert:
She actually is making her own cakes.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, good for you, Lucy. Where?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, she's in Charleston now. She's coming back to do a lot of press with us, but she's a wonderful chef and a wonderful cook, and she bakes cakes for people special order.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, that's fun. How involved was Stephen?
Evie McGee Colbert:
He was very involved. Very involved. Stephen is one of those people that is happy to not get involved if you don't ask him, but if you ask him, he's not going to be sort of involved. I used to laugh like if I was working on something in the house. Let's say we're doing a construction project. I would ask him a question and then I'd go, turns out I really didn't want your opinion. I'm sorry, I asked. Because he always has an opinion. But he was very involved. And we stumbled into the dialogue of the book because we realized the recipes needed to be introduced, and we were well, who should do this one and who should do that one? And then I'd write one and he'd say, "Well, I want to respond to that." So it just organically grew into this pattern between the two of us, which became really fun.
Kerry Diamond:
The back and forth is fun. I've looked at maybe thousands of cookbooks at this point. I've never seen that in a cookbook.
Evie McGee Colbert:
We didn't set out saying we would do that, but because some of the recipes were mine and some were his, I would say, "You should write about that one." And then I'd say, "But I want to say something too." So it just happened and we did everything together, which was really fun, actually. Really fun.
Kerry Diamond:
Stephen's been able to do some cooking demos over the years with some real world-class people. José Andrés, et cetera. Has any of that rubbed off on him?
Evie McGee Colbert:
You know what rubbed off on him, which is really funny, and he'd be the first to say this, he learned how to cook because he was a waiter for maybe like eight years or something. And he's an observant person. So he'd be back in the kitchen and he'd watch the chef and he'd learn certain things. So he's a very quick study. Let's say he cooks with José Andrés, he'll come home and he'll say, "Look what we made." And he'll make it again. So he's a confident and an ambitious cook.
Kerry Diamond:
Was he a waiter in Charleston?
Evie McGee Colbert:
No. In Chicago.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, in Chicago. Okay. Charleston's a big character in your book.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah. It is a big character. And it was a big character in both our lives.
Kerry Diamond:
So you two met in Charleston?
Evie McGee Colbert:
We did, but much later in life.
Kerry Diamond:
Which I can't believe because Charleston's such a small place.
Evie McGee Colbert:
I know. And we have a lot of mutual friends. Well, he's one year younger than I am. The first time I think we ever were introduced ... Although we both believe we were at a lot of the parties at the same time. But we were introduced by a friend when I was a student at the University of Virginia, and he was at Hampden-Sydney College. I went over for a party there to see a friend of mine. Someone introduced me to him, and I was getting ready to go to England to spend my junior year in England. And I thought who is this skinny kid from Charleston. He's younger than I am. I'm not interested. He describes me as this icy cold girl. Needless to say, nothing sparked.
Years go by and then we're back. I actually was living in New York. He was living in Chicago, but we're both back for the Spoleto Festival at a party. And I didn't recognize that he was the guy I'd met all those years ago. I saw him and thought, that's an actor. He was wearing a sharkskin suit, which I'd never seen before. Little did I know he paid $10 for it at a thrift store. And I thought, oh, he looks like he's from New York. Who is that guy? And I walked up and started talking to him. When we started talking, I went, oh my God, you're Stephen Colbert. And I think I probably turned purple. I was so embarrassed. Because someone from your hometown, you might act differently than someone who you think is a New York actor.
Kerry Diamond:
Exactly. Exactly. And he grew up one of 11.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah. He did. The baby. The baby.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, he was the baby.
Evie McGee Colbert:
He's the baby. His family always laughs. They're like, "It's amazing he learned to walk because his sisters carried him everywhere." He was a little bit of the prince, they call him.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. One of 11.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
That's amazing. Dinnertime must've been chaos.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Chaos I guess but Stephen's mother was wonderful, just an amazing person in that she, I think raised all 11 children with a sense of joy. They're a wonderful family. They all love and support each other. And I think it's because it was a fun house. It was a happy house. So although she might've been upset with the dust on the table, she didn't let that worry her. She would play with her children.
Kerry Diamond:
I guess in a sense, 11, 12, 13-
Evie McGee Colbert:
You just got to let go.
Kerry Diamond:
It's a party every day.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah. I think she used to say it got easier after five.
Kerry Diamond:
Another big influence on the book is friends and family in particular, your mother.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Can you tell us about her?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, she was wonderful. My mother died in November of 2022, but luckily we'd started working on the book before that. So she was a part of the early stages of the book, and we would talk about recipes all the time. My mother was one of those people who just made people feel happy and comfortable. She was welcoming in terms of hospitality, but even more than that, she was welcoming in terms of her heart. She just made people feel like she saw them for who they were. At her funeral I said in the eulogy that so many people after she died said to me, your mother was like a mother to me. And it really surprised me because she was a mother to me. But she just had a wonderful ability to see people as the way they wanted to be seen and accept them that way. And cooking is an act of love and I think that was part of what she would do. She would have parties. She would host people to her home and just be welcoming. Nothing was too serious. Nothing was too formal. Beautiful, elegant, but not judgmental.
Kerry Diamond:
I'm sorry that you lost her and she doesn't get to see the finished book.
Evie McGee Colbert:
I know. And my father passed away in April, so sadly he didn't see it either. But they were both a part of the process. I feel lucky about that.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, that's great. Well, your mother really permeates the book. She was what you would call a classic southern hostess.
Evie McGee Colbert:
She really was. She really was. So she was raised in Marion, South Carolina, and she moved to Charleston to teach school maybe 1957 or '58. She and my dad got married in 1960, and my sister was born nine months later in 1961. I was born in 1963. So my mother, I think, had a little bit of a sense of country girl come to town. Charleston was a big city for her. And the “Charleston Receipts” cookbook was what all of her colleagues and friends cooked out of. So that became the Bible for her and the Bible that I cooked everything out of that book. And that was her starting point. She became much more confident later with cooking. But I think in the early days, that was what imprinted on her, how to host a party with the food and that cookbook, that kind of thing.
Kerry Diamond:
And you said receipts.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
Not everyone's going to know what that means.
Evie McGee Colbert:
I know. Well, the cookbook is “Charleston Receipts.” It's an old Junior League cookbook, and it's one of those things where each recipe is Mrs. John Smith or something like that. And I think you probably know better than I do, but I think the term receipts, originally, you would basically jot down the recipe and hand it to someone rather than using the book or something like that.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, I don't even know that.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Stephen talks about that. He says that's the etymology of the word. But my mother would use the word receipts, and I think I'd never-
Kerry Diamond:
In lieu of “recipe.”
Evie McGee Colbert:
In lieu of “recipe.” And I never even thought about why until Stephen and I started working on this book, and I started writing receipts and he'd say, "Why are you doing that?" And I was like, "Well, I thought ... I don't know. It's just the word that comes out." You grow up with certain words. And my family certainly had a lot of old-fashioned words that I just used not knowing they were old-fashioned.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us about some of your mom's recipes. Your mom's Patti McGee.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Patti McGee. My parents are really funny. She was also Evelyn. My mother was Evelyn McGee, but her mother was Evelyn. I'm the third Evelyn. So my mother's nickname was Patti. So she went by Patti. My father's real name was Joseph, but his nickname was Peter. So it was like having two sets of parents. If you went to the bank, your parents were Joseph and Evelyn McGee. If you went to a party, your parents were Peter and Patti McGee. It was really funny.
Kerry Diamond:
That's a lot to keep straight. That's funny.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah. It was funny. You asked me about her recipes. So the cheese biscuits, the first recipe in the cookbook, mom became known for those because she gave them away every Christmas. Hundreds. Hundreds of plates of cheese biscuits. And people always wanted them. And they would say, "Can I get on your list for the cheese biscuits?" She'd take them everywhere. She wouldn't walk out the door without a paper plate with Christmas wrapping paper, and she'd hand it to the hairdresser and the bank, everywhere. And so that just became for holidays. Stephen's funny. He walks in the kitchen if I'm making the cheese biscuits, and he's like, "I need a glass of bourbon because they go together."
Kerry Diamond:
So is the recipe in the book your mom's recipe?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
Wow. You really didn't have to change it much.
Evie McGee Colbert:
No. That one I knew and I had her blessing, as I said. She said, "Of course, we'll put it in the book." The thing that I'd forgotten. So sadly, since my parents have both passed away, my sister and I have been cleaning their house this summer, and I found in a box a file that says Flory's Cheese Biscuits. So my mother's best friend was a woman named Flory Fair who passed away in her 50s. And my mother was around the same age. And I think at that time, my mother said ... They both made the cheese biscuits, but she said, "I'm going to continue this in memory of my friend Flory." So I found this piece of paper where my mother described, "I've inherited these from Flory." I didn't have that in the cookbook because I didn't remember it. They were always Patti's Cheese Biscuits to me. But you know how that is with recipes, you share them with friends, and then you go back and you think, whose was it originally? Who gets the real credit?
Kerry Diamond:
Absolutely.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
It's so interesting, just so many layers to this book. It must be so emotional.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It is emotional.
Kerry Diamond:
If you were to pick it up and flip through it.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It is emotional, particularly having lost both my parents. It's very emotional. But I feel so blessed that it happened at the time that it did, and that they both were able to share their ideas and thoughts. I think I mentioned this in the book. One afternoon my mother and I decided to look for my grandmother's old recipe box, which we found and we hadn't had it for years. And that was my father's mother. So she died when I was only one or something. I hadn't really known her, but she was a wonderful cook. Old Charleston recipes and all on an index card, handwritten. And you'd have to decipher. It would just be like a handful of this or a heaping thing of that. You wouldn't know exactly what it meant. That's where Lucy came in handy and Chris Styler, they would test everything and make it into a real recipe. I think the chess pie came out of that. There are a couple of things.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, I was so happy you had chess pie in the book. What did you do with those recipe cards? Do you still have them somewhere?
Evie McGee Colbert:
We still have them somewhere.
Kerry Diamond:
It's so funny because that's pretty much lost as a tradition.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It is, isn't it? And that was a funny thing when we started this cookbook, I have scraps of paper all over the kitchen stuffed in other books or in a folder. I don't have a nice, neat filing system alphabetized the way that was.
Kerry Diamond:
For those who've never had cheese biscuits walk us through the recipe a little bit.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Sure. Sure. So it's really basically very simple. Well, what my mother always said was the perfect balance was one stick of butter and one stick of margarine. That was her magic. She insisted on Cracker Barrel Extra Sharp Cheese. Had to be that. So what she would do is get a double boiler and she would melt the butter and margarine and then grate the cheddar cheese into that. Then take it off the heat. You don't want it to curdle. Sift self-rising flour. Two cups of self-rising flour into that same pot. Mix it together, put a good pinch of cayenne pepper, then put it in the fridge to harden. You need to make sure it doesn't separate. So once it's cold then it just becomes dough essentially. And you roll heaping a ball like the size of a tablespoon. And she would put a half a can dipped in egg white to keep it on and just plop it down there.
Towards the end of her life, she would give my dad jobs. Everyone had a job and he would take the timer. They still had an old kitchen timer. And he'd time it to whatever, 15 minutes or whatever. Again, that was something I'd never timed because I'd always do it by smell. So when we went to write the recipe, I'd have to go, how much time do you actually cook these for? Because I just wait until they smell right.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, I love that. And I also love the party food section. That was my absolute favorite. A lot of that is your mom.
Evie McGee Colbert:
A lot of that is my mom, because she gave parties every day of the Spoleto Festival for 20 years. She was always a wonderful hostess, but she became a pro at throwing together a party. In fact, when my sister and I were going through their house this summer, we found boxes of tablecloths and I laughed. I said, "I didn't realize she had so many tablecloths." But most, because the weather's often beautiful, there'd be outside courtyard parties and matching tablecloths. There are a lot of recipes we didn't put in there that mom became known for. There was one that my family used to love called Adrian's Delight, which is cream cheese and golden raisins and slivered almonds.
Kerry Diamond:
As soon as you said that, I was like, I think it's going to go in that-
Evie McGee Colbert:
Cheese ball.
Kerry Diamond:
Cheese ball or ambrosia direction.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, ambrosia. My grandmother used to bring ambrosia to Christmas dinner every year. Yeah, old-fashioned, right?
Kerry Diamond:
Ambrosia's making a comeback. I was at the Wynn in Las Vegas, and they did a table side jello service.
Evie McGee Colbert:
You're kidding.
Kerry Diamond:
But they slice it and mix it with homemade marshmallow cream-
Evie McGee Colbert:
You're kidding.
Kerry Diamond:
And fruits and nuts. Yep. It was fantastic.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Maybe in our second cookbook we'll bring it back.
Kerry Diamond:
There you go. Tell me some of your favorites in the party food section.
Evie McGee Colbert:
I am a big fan of the bacon wrapped dates. That's a friend of ours, Sherry Pincus would help us with our Christmas parties.
Kerry Diamond:
Hard to eat just one of those.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh my God. So good. And I actually don't eat bacon anymore, but still, give me a date and an almond and oof. And they just smell good. They make the house smell fantastic. And of course, I love the cheese biscuits. We have the shrimp paste in there. I think the shrimp paste is just a classic Charleston.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us that because people hear the word paste and don't necessarily think that sounds great.
Evie McGee Colbert:
I think we should say shrimp dip, but we grew up saying shrimp paste. Back when I was a kid in Charleston, everybody used Mrs. Handy, the caterer. I don't know if that rings a bell, but she would make these little shrimp paste sandwiches with white bread with the crust cut off, and that was just what you always had at a party. And so I just grew up having that. So basically it's just ground up shrimp with a little bit of mayonnaise seasoned. And I say a little bit. You can't use ... It's got to be shrimp forward. It's not like mayonnaise with a taste of shrimp. It's shrimp with a little binding of mayonnaise. It's not too fishy. It's just a great spread. Put it on a cracker or a sandwich. It's really good with a slice of tomato. That's a good sandwich.
Kerry Diamond:
Sounds good.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Let's go back to margarine. I did not see margarine in your cookbook.
Evie McGee Colbert:
No.
Kerry Diamond:
Did you get rid of all the margarine?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, it was interesting. So with mom's cheese Biscuits, the cookbook producer, and I think they were right, it was like, you can't just say you have to use this. So we came up with other options, but mom always believed that one stick and margarine was really important. And Lucy's much more of a cook than I am. And she was saying different margarines have different fat content. So it really depended on that balance. I don't know that my mother was enough of a scientist to know why, but she just knew they turned out better consistency. Because the interesting thing with a cheese butter flour cracker or cookie, whatever you want to call it could either be too flaky or it could be too runny, and you just don't know. And you'll take a batch out and they'll be too spready or they'll taste dry. So there's in exact science to it for sure. But we didn't use a lot of margarine. Most of the time we used real butter. In fact, Stephen is funny. He's a butter snob I like to call him.
Kerry Diamond:
Okay .but I've got to ask, what is your favorite mayonnaise?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, no question. Dukes. Got to be Duke’s mayonnaise.
Kerry Diamond:
Knew you were going to say Duke’s. I also saw boiled peanuts in the book and have to ask, are you friends with the Lee Brothers, the kings of the boiled peanut.
Evie McGee Colbert:
The kings of boiled peanuts. Yes. We do know the Lee Brothers and their cookbooks are so well researched, they're practically like encyclopedias. My hats off to them. And all the deep dives they've done on the origins of all these southern recipes. Stephen and I from day one went, well, we don't have to do it, they did that. We're not going to do that. But the thing about boiled peanuts is to me, when my sister and I were younger and we'd have friends from college or something, it was like a rite of passage. They had to taste a boiled peanut. And we would laugh. We'd say, "If you don't like these, I'm not sure I'm inviting you back."
Kerry Diamond:
What's not to love about a boiled peanut?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, we also say it's pretty much like a big spoonful of the ocean because it's salt with a little peanut.
Kerry Diamond:
And then biscuits. You've got a lot of biscuit love in the cookbook. Callie's Hot Little Biscuit.
I love Carrie who's got Callie's down there and Charleston.
Evie McGee Colbert:
I know I have one of her cookbooks. It's wonderful. And when we were starting ours, I looked through that cookbook. It's beautiful. Those are great. Those biscuits are great.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. You've got so much good food in Charleston.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It's amazing, isn't it?
Kerry Diamond:
It's a great food city.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Another ingredient, this might be controversial. There are no raisins in your carrot cake.
Evie McGee Colbert:
You know what's interesting about that? Back when I would make the banana bread that I was talking about all the time, my kids were little and they didn't want the raisins in the banana bread. So I just got in the habit of no raisins for a long time.
Kerry Diamond:
I have never heard of raisins and banana bread.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, see, I like raisins in banana bread.
Kerry Diamond:
I'm anti-raisin and baked goods. I bring this up because I was very happy not to see raisins in your carrot cake
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, well, that's Lucy. Lucy helped us with the carrot cake too. She, as I said, is a wonderful baker. But why are you anti raisin?
Kerry Diamond:
I don't know. I don't know. I don't mind snacking on raisins. I love a golden raisin, especially in a savory presentation.
Evie McGee Colbert:
So say bring back the Adrian's Delight. I'm going to make it for you.
Kerry Diamond:
But yeah. It's something about a raisin and a baked good.
Evie McGee Colbert:
What about a scone with raisins? No?
Kerry Diamond:
No. And an oatmeal raisin cookie.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, yum.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh gosh. I don't know. Maybe something from my childhood. I'll ask my mother about that one.
Evie McGee Colbert:
One. Well, it's funny how things get imprinted on you, right? Our middle son, Peter, who's now 26, he loved bananas as a baby. And then one day he was like, "No more bananas." And he hasn't had one since. I think I fed him too many bananas. So sometimes you can have a childhood experience and that just does it for you with the food.
Kerry Diamond:
True. True. I couldn't eat bananas at all growing up. Now I love them.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh. Well, there you go.
Kerry Diamond:
Banana bread, smoothies, whatever. Yeah.
Evie McGee Colbert:
You never know.
Kerry Diamond:
I know. It's interesting how your taste buds change.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
With time. Tell me what you think a great gateway recipe would be in terms of what is a terrific introduction and if they nail this one thing, it unlocks the rest of the book for them.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, that's an interesting question.
Kerry Diamond:
Or just where do you want them to start?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, I guess maybe with the cheese biscuits, just because we start the book there and because they're so emotional and I love them so much. And I will say I think they're somewhat unique. Although there are lots of cheese straws around. This is just a little bit more of a mixture of a biscuit and a cheese cracker or something. They're easy to make. So if you nail that, you've got something to give people every time you have them over for a party. Just stick some on a table and they'll eat one.
Kerry Diamond:
I don't want to give people the wrong idea of the book. I of course completely focused on the party food and the dessert. There's a lot to this book. You've got all different types of food.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah, I think we have over a hundred. We had to cut recipes actually. If you'd told us when we started, we didn't know we'd come up with them. But I think that's the best way. You start and then you weed out. But yeah, there are over a hundred recipes. And we do have drinks in the book too.
Kerry Diamond:
You've got main dishes, you've got cocktails, you've got all of it.
Evie McGee Colbert:
And like I said, we have involvement from all of our family. So Lucy, who I've been talking about, her father is Bunky, who's in the cookbook.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, her father is Bunky.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Her father is Bunky.
Kerry Diamond:
I was convinced I knew Bunky. I had to look him up.
Evie McGee Colbert:
You might know Bunky. He's also a Charlestonian, and I keep saying, "Bunky, you're the hero and the star of this cookbook." Because he is first of all an incredible cook. But he also just epitomizes to me what's wonderful about cooking and living on Sullivan's Island. He makes softshell crabs, which are just unbelievably delicious. And we have this picture of him barefooted on the dock, frying up softshell crabs. Who doesn't want that life? Right there on the water and-
Kerry Diamond:
And the nickname Bunky.
Evie McGee Colbert:
And he's just as nice as his nickname.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, that's great.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
That's great. What do you think Stephen would say is his favorite recipe?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Ooh. I don't know. I guess we'd have to go by category. I know in the desserts, he loves sticky toffee pudding. That's one of his absolute favorites. He likes to make those scalloped potatoes in the sides and vegetables. That's something he's been making for a long time. He's also a huge fan of that Beef Wellington, and he does it so beautifully. It's too complicated for me and I don't have the patience for it, but he's a process guy, and so he'll just say, "I'm going to start it." It takes a couple of days. You have to plan ahead.
Kerry Diamond:
So you're not as much of a project baker or cook, would you say?
Evie McGee Colbert:
No. Well, he's ambitious and I'm a rule follower. I think we say in the book, which is something that just we both discovered while we were chatting, left alone, he said, "I'd make my most ambitious meal." And I said, "Left alone, I'd have a bowl of cereal." And I think it just says so much about us as people. He's an improviser and he likes to create and he likes to challenge himself and I sometimes ... If no one needs anything from me, then I'm just like, I just need to be a little quiet and just have a little Evie time, which might involve yogurt and cereal and that'd just suit me fine.
Kerry Diamond:
All right. Let's talk about your non-food life. Along with Stephen, you're co-founder of Spartina Industries, which is a production company with a first look deal at CBS Studios. Tell us about Spartina.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, it's super exciting. Carrie Byalick is the president of our company and she runs it now. And the first thing we did was a film called “In and of Itself,” which is a movie adaptation of Derek DelGaudio's one man show that ran in New York and it was a wonderful project. We both really enjoyed working with on that and decided that that was something we really felt like we could do together. The next thing we did was a pickleball special. But our big project right now is we're producers of “After Midnight” with Taylor Tomlinson, which airs on CBS following Stephen's show every night. So we've been producing that, and that's been really fun. We have a couple of projects in the works. We are working on a limited series of the “Chronicles of Amber” with Roger Zelazny. Stephen's a huge science fiction fan, and there's a lot about that series that we were excited about bringing to life. So there's a lot in the works, and it's, again, really exciting for us to work together. This is a new stage of our relationship that we're really enjoying. Not that we didn't work together before. We raised our children together, but side by side creating things is fun.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah, you've got a lot of projects.
Evie McGee Colbert:
We do.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah. That and the cookbook.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Right. And we still-
Kerry Diamond:
Lot of quality time.
Evie McGee Colbert:
We still like each other.
Kerry Diamond:
That's good to hear. You're also the founder of Montclair Film.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
An arts nonprofit in Montclair, New Jersey. We love Montclair. Bobbi Brown.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Exactly.
Kerry Diamond:
One of the famous Montclair residents.
Evie McGee Colbert:
We've been there for 24 years.
Kerry Diamond:
What is the mission of the organization and can you talk about some of the initiatives?
Evie McGee Colbert:
I'm so glad you asked me. It's really been a love project for me for a long time. Bob Feinberg, who no longer lives in Montclair, but he was a colleague of mine, he and I started the festival with a lot of other people as a film festival was our first idea. The Montclair Film Festival. And it came after the recession of '08 as an idea to bring an economic boost to Montclair. Some of the restaurants had closed, the nonprofit theater had closed then. It was one of those things where you don't know what you're doing until you do it. We basically created a board of directors. We hired Thom Powers and his wife, Raphaela Neihausen, to be our first co-directors and we put on a festival. It was four days, 40 films. It was small. We are now a year-round nonprofit.
We now have a very robust education program where we teach all sorts of film classes and storytelling, editing, makeup, all those kind of things. We run a six screen movie theater called the Claridge Theater, which is over a hundred years old in Montclair. And our festival, which opens this year, October 18th, and runs-
Kerry Diamond:
Ooh. That's soon.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yes, very soon. Runs for 10 days in October. We have usually over 140 films and events. It's very a robust festival. We're a big organization now. We're doing a lot. And it's actually very exciting time, I think, for the state of New Jersey because under Governor Murphy, there are now tax credits for film production in New Jersey. So a lot of-
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, that's a big deal.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It's a really big deal and a lot of film is coming to New Jersey. There are a lot of studios being built in New Jersey, which will probably come online in a couple of years. So we at Montclair Film really see this as a moment where we can focus on preparing workforce, workforce development programs and teaching people some of the jobs that are career jobs and union jobs that sometimes you don't need a degree in college. And I think there are a lot of really wonderful opportunities for people who might want to work in the film industry and they don't know about it. So that's something we're looking to do more of.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, fantastic. How can people get involved?
Evie McGee Colbert:
They can just go to our website. There's a lot of links. Volunteer, sign up, submit a movie. Although I think we just on Friday are closing this year's festival because as I mentioned, we open on October 18th. But the website is montclairfilm.org and we'd love people to just come experience a festival or come see a movie at the Claridge Theater or just come to our headquarters, take a class. There's a lot going on.
Kerry Diamond:
What have you learned about yourself as an entrepreneur?
Evie McGee Colbert:
I think I've learned to listen first and then give your opinion later. And that's hard. Sometimes I'm not good at it. But I try very much to listen to what everybody else is saying and then think through how can we all collaborate? Or if I disagree, why do I disagree? To listen to what someone else might've said and if I disagree to put it in the context of what they've said. So maybe I've just learned the art of listening a little bit more than I probably had before. And collaboration. How important communication is. Nine times out of 10, any problem is because the communication wasn't there or wasn't good enough. So I think that's also really important is, again, talking it through with whoever you're talking to.
Kerry Diamond:
How about working with your spouse?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah. Also communication. Also communication. The biggest challenge for us is not communication. Luckily, I think we communicate very well. It's that we have such busy lives. And so there'll be this sense of we've got to make this decision and days will go by before we have time for the two of us to sit down and make that decision. And that is frustrating because I'm a real doer. I'm a real task-oriented person, and I want to just cross that off my list. And sometimes he'll say, "I cannot think about that until Friday." So patience. Maybe I'll throw that one in there too. That's another thing you need to develop when you collaborate with people is patience and understanding their schedule may not be your schedule.
Kerry Diamond:
We talk a lot with our guests on the show about trusting your gut. And I was curious, have you learned to trust your gut and how did you learn that?
Evie McGee Colbert:
You know what, I don't think I have. I think I have more to learn in terms of trusting my gut. And what I find happens all the time is I'll say, "Gosh, I wish I had trusted my gut." Whatever it is, I'll say, "You know what, my gut said no and I thought, okay, maybe we'll do it." And I should have trusted my gut. I think giving that sense, that trusting your gut feeling, bringing it forward and saying to yourself, why do I think that? Right? If your gut says you shouldn't go to that thing, why are you saying that? Or you shouldn't answer that email. Why are you saying that? And if it's because of fear, maybe that's not right. But if it's because you think there's no positive outcome, then maybe your gut is right. So examining maybe what your instinct is.
Kerry Diamond:
And how about a motto or a mantra that gets you through the day?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Well, interesting. Well, we have a family one that's funny and we fell into it because Stephen and I are about to celebrate our 31st wedding anniversary.
Kerry Diamond:
Congratulations.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Thank you. We got married in Charleston in October, and our wedding was at my family's home on Anson Street. At the time, my parents lived on Anson Street. And one day, I don't know if it was the day before the wedding or a couple of days before the wedding, my father said to Stephen and a couple of his friends, "Okay. We got to move some more furniture." Because the wedding was in the house, the reception was in the house, so things just had to be moved all the time. And Dad, according to Stephen, got in the front seat of the car and took a deep breath and he said, "Fellas, you just got to stay loose. Just stay loose." And that's become our family motto. We say it all the time, just stay loose.
Kerry Diamond:
I love this. I think every family should have a family motto.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yeah, I know. Well, we fell into it because it's odd. You don't think that's important, but how many times do you think I need to breathe, I need to stay loose. It'll figure itself out. And my father was wonderful that way. He was a very half-full kind of person. And if there was a difficult situation, he'd say, "It'll figure itself out. We'll get there."
Kerry Diamond:
Let's do a speed round. This has been so much fun. What beverage do you start the morning with?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Coffee. Oh boy.
Kerry Diamond:
How do you take it?
Evie McGee Colbert:
I take it with a little milk and I've actually trained myself to have half decaf, half regular, so I can have two to three cups.
Kerry Diamond:
What's always in your fridge?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yogurt, eggs is always in our fridge, and probably milk for the coffee.
Kerry Diamond:
And Duke's mayo.
Evie McGee Colbert:
And Duke's mayo.
Kerry Diamond:
What is a treasured cookbook of yours?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, I guess the “Charleston Receipts.” I think I have three copies.
Kerry Diamond:
Favorite kitchen implement?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Spatula. I like to bake. So the cookies or the pancakes, that kind of spatula. You can have the rubber one or the flipper. I mean like the flipper. I love that one.
Kerry Diamond:
What was your favorite childhood food?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Peanut butter. I was a big peanut butter and jelly girl.
Kerry Diamond:
I love peanut butter. I still love it now. I sometimes think, I don't know what it would do if it weren't for peanut butter.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, I know. Well, this is so silly, but during COVID when you couldn't get fresh ground peanut butter or fresh ground almond butter at the stores, I was like, "Well, what am I going to do? I love it."
Kerry Diamond:
Did you make your own?
Evie McGee Colbert:
No. I should have. I definitely should have. I did not.
Kerry Diamond:
What is a dream vacation destination?
Evie McGee Colbert:
I've never been to Australia. I'd love to go there. I love going to the Caribbean. We've been to Turks and Caicos. We love that. We love the Cayman Islands. We've done that over the years. I'm a warm-weather girl. So a favorite vacation would be on the beach with a cocktail and the sun shining.
Kerry Diamond:
Sounds perfect.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Yep.
Kerry Diamond:
Favorite smell?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Babies.
Kerry Diamond:
Aww.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Babies' heads. You know how their heads smell. I haven't had a baby in a long time, obviously.
Kerry Diamond:
What are you streaming right now?
Evie McGee Colbert:
We watched the new season of “Slow Horses” last night, and I can't breathe until the second episode. It's such a cliffhanger. But boy, I love it. I love it. It's really good.
Kerry Diamond:
What is your favorite food film?
Evie McGee Colbert:
“The Taste of Things.” We showed that at the festival last year. It's really great. Have you seen it?
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Juliette Binoche.
Kerry Diamond:
And Juliette was on the show when-
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, she was? Oh.
Kerry Diamond:
When the movie came out. It's just staggeringly beautiful.
Evie McGee Colbert:
It is so beautiful.
Kerry Diamond:
Okay. You can't say your husband for the answer. If you had to be trapped on a desert island with one food celebrity, who would it be and why?
Evie McGee Colbert:
Ina Garten. I love Ina. She's just the nicest, warmest, most wonderful person. And we were lucky enough to record an episode with her this past spring, and she just filled this place in my heart that took the void of losing my mother. Anyway. I love Ina. I'd love to spend more time with Ina.
Kerry Diamond:
We all agree. I think Ina is the number one answer.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Oh, is she?
Kerry Diamond:
We all adore Ina and we adore you now too.
Evie McGee Colbert:
Thank you so much for the time and the interest and the support of our book. We appreciate it.
Kerry Diamond:
That's it for today's show. We mentioned my interview with Juliette Binoche. If you would like to hear our episode with the star of “The Taste of Things,” which Evie picked as her favorite food film, you can find that link in our show notes. Our theme song is by the band Tralala. Thank you to the teams at Cityvox and Good Studio. Our producers are Catherine Baker and Elizabeth Vogt. Our associate producer is Jenna Sadhu, and our content and partnerships manager is Londyn Crenshaw. Thanks for listening, everybody. You're the Bombe.