Samantha Sheehan Transcript
Kerry Diamond:
Hi, everyone. You are listening to Radio Cherry Bombe, and I'm your host, Kerry Diamond, coming to you today from my closet in my apartment in Brooklyn. The interview you're about to hear was recorded at Rockefeller Center in the heart of New York city. As you know, each week, we talk to the coolest culinary personalities around, the folks shaping and shaking up the food scene. Today's guest is Samantha Sheehan, the winemaker and entrepreneur based in Napa, California. Samantha is the force behind three different brands, POE Wines, Ultraviolet Wines, and Mommenpop Aperitifs. She also collaborates with folks like Une Femme Wines and Foxtrot Market. I think you'll love Samantha's story, especially if you're thinking about changing careers.
This episode of Radio Cherry Bombe is supported by Kaserei Champignon, a 100-year-old cheese producer and the maker of Cambozola. This fine cheese, which I happen to like very much, is made with variant Alpine milk and crafted by master cheesemakers dedicated to using all-natural ingredients and traditional methods to create one-of-a-kind cheeses. Cambozola, a tripe cream soft ripened cheese with delicate notes of blue is truly a cheese like no other. For more intense experience, try Cambozola Black Label, aged longer and colder than Cambozola Classic. This bold and exceptionally creamy cheese was a 2022 Best in Class Winner at the renowned World Championship Cheese Contest.
Whether part of an extraordinary cheese board or an ingredient in a remarkable recipe, Cambozola is an opportunity to taste the extraordinary. To celebrate 40 years in the U.S. market. Cambozola is giving away three luxurious beach vacations, up to $10,000 in value. Visit thisisfinecheese.com for more information and to enter. While you're there, you can find recipes, pairings, and what stores near you carry Cambozola. That's thisisfinecheese.com. Don't forget, it's not blue, it's not brie, it's Cambozola.
Today's episode is also sponsored by Helbraun Levy, the country's premier full-service law firm focused on the legal and licensing needs of the hospitality and cannabis industries. I'd did not know this when I was starting out as an entrepreneur, although I should have, but a good lawyer is as essential as a good business idea. A decade ago, I would have told you that you need great social media, a great website, and a great mission statement, and all of those things are true, but what you need first is a solid foundation. That starts with caring, informed, and savvy legal counsel.
The team at Helbraun Levy represents Cherry Bombe and many of the top names in hospitality. They've helped us a lot over the years, underscore a lot, with solid advice and wise counsel, and they're always there to help us navigate the wild world of business. Whether you're an entrepreneur or just starting out, an aspiring business owner, or you think it's time for serious representation, consider working with Helbraun Levy. For a free consultation, visit helbraunlevy.com. Also, Helbraun Levy has a great hospitality industry newsletter that I enjoy and find very useful. You can sign up for free at Helbraun Levy's website and check out their past newsletters while you're there.
We've got a little housekeeping. The new issue of Cherry Bombe Magazine, yes, we have a print magazine, is ut now. Pick up a copy at your favorite book or cookbook shop or magazine store. You also can order from cherrybombe.com. What else? Monday, May 2nd, is the last day to vote in the Foxtrot Up & Comers Competition Fan Favorite category. Go to foxtrotco.com/upandcomers. That will be in our show notes if you didn't write that down. There are four fun brands duking it out for the prize, which is $5,000 cash money, a spot on the Foxtrot shelves, and $20,000 in marketing support. Hit pause and go vote. We'll wait for you.
All right, you're back. One last thing. This week is the finale of Julia, the HBO Max Original Series based on the life of Julia Child. I've been hosting Dishing On Julia, the official companion podcast, and I hope you've been listening. If not, you have lots of great episodes of both the show and the podcast to enjoy. You can find the show streaming now on HBO Max, and the podcast can be found on all podcast platforms. Now, let's check in with today's guest.
Samantha, welcome to Radio Cherry Bombe.
Samantha Sheehan:
Thank you. Thank you for having me.
Kerry Diamond:
It is so exciting to have you here, and you've never done a podcast before-
Samantha Sheehan:
Never.
Kerry Diamond:
... so welcome. We are so excited to be your first podcast.
Samantha Sheehan:
Aw, thank you.
Kerry Diamond:
This is great. Would love to know a little bit about you pre-wine world. Where did you grow up?
Samantha Sheehan:
I grew up in Los Angeles. My father really wanted me to be an accountant, and then when I was in college, Enron happened and Sarbanes-Oxley really became an important thing, and so my-
Kerry Diamond:
So Enron?
Samantha Sheehan:
... Enron.
Kerry Diamond:
That whole debacle, yes.
Samantha Sheehan:
The whole scandal-
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah.
Samantha Sheehan:
... yeah, and so my Dad said if I wanted to be an executive at a company, I had to understand accounting so I could sign-off on financial statements. My Dad was very practical. His parents survived the Great Depression. His mother was a school teacher, his father was a painter, so he knew he grew up without a lot of money and he was like very practical and always wanted me to have a great career. I loved science and that's always what I wanted to study, and he told me I couldn't make any money as a scientists and if I was going to go to college and he was going to pay for it, I had to become an accountant, which was so random because it was really not what I was good at, but yeah, I studied accounting and economics in college.
Then, I went on to work at Deloitte in the International Tax Consulting Group, and it's like a really, really nice company, and then I decided I would go to law school. I got into Tulane, I had a scholarship, and then I decided to go up to Napa on vacation. I walked into a wine shop in Yountville and the owner asked what I did, and I said, "Oh, I'm going to law school to become a tax accountant."
I think I had this look on my face like I wasn't really sure, and he was like, "Well, is that what you love to do?" I said, "No, actually, I really love champagne. I love wine. I wish I was in the wine business." He said, "Well, why don't you take a job at a winery?" I was like, "Well, who would hire me? I have not skills at all in winemaking, like I have accounting skills." He said, "Oh, well, there's a winemaker who just sold his brand and he's opening a new winery in Downtown Napa, you should call him," so I did. I called him and he was hilarious. He answered the phone. He was kind of like the caterpillar in Alice in Wonderland. He was like, "Hello?" I was like, "Hi, I'm calling because I hear that you're hiring for this new job."
He goes, "I'm what?" It was like the strangest phone call I've ever had, and he was like, "Well, go and meet my," eventually, he said, "Go and meet my general manager at the winery." I went down. Just like on a whim, I stayed an extra day to go meet him. I showed up, I had these like cute little Fendy shoes and like little work skirt. I was like all dressed up and these guys were in like steel-toed work boots and jeans.
The GM said, "Well, okay, we'll hire you. We'll pay you 36,000 a year," which is about like a third of what I was making at Deloitte, "and your job is to make sure that Sean," who I now a great friend of mine, "doesn't fall off the ladder." I was like, "That's my job?" They were like, "Yeah, do you want it or not?" It was just very, very like take it or leave it, and I was like, "I'll take it. You're going to pay me to learn about wine."
Kerry Diamond:
Okay, wait, I have to stop you there. This all happened because you walked into that wine shop?
Samantha Sheehan:
Uh-huh.
Kerry Diamond:
Had you been thinking about this prior to that? Like, "I need to leave this world and get into wine?"
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, I kind of had that thought like in the back of my head, but I just didn't think that there was a way to get in. I think the wine world from the outside, I don't know if it still feels that way, but I feel like 11, 12 years ago it felt very much like you had to come from the wine world. It seemed like it was probably multigenerational and you had to have like inherited this winery. I didn't think you could just walk into it.
Kerry Diamond:
You helped this man not fall off a ladder.
Samantha Sheehan:
Mm-hmm. He never did fall off.
Kerry Diamond:
Thank you for clarifying.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, he never fell off. He was very strong-
Kerry Diamond:
That's funny.
Samantha Sheehan:
... and I ended up working harvest.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us what that means.
Samantha Sheehan:
The facility was like brand new. It was just sort of a building that had all these wine barrels in it, but really had to be built out as a winery, so we put in roll-up doors, we put in floor drains, we bought a press, we bought a destemmer, all of the equipment. That was incredible to just like learn about all of the equipment and how much it cost and, of course, like having this accounting background, I think I ended up being pretty useful. Then, in end of August, harvest started, and so it was like all hands on deck. I ended up working harvest, which started at about 7:00 in the morning and ended at about 2:00 in the morning, seven days a week. It was crazy.
Kerry Diamond:
It's intense.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, I lost, I think, seven pounds. The first month I was covered in bruises. It was like tired and grumpy and cold, but it was like the best time in my life. We were mostly making Napa Cabernet, which was a great experience. I learned all about like the science and sort of like the technical side of winemaking.
Kerry Diamond:
Was it all coming naturally for you?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, I think because I really loved science and it was always very like logical to me. I always did really well in science classes and waking up, you know, at like 6:00 in the morning, getting to the winery kind of just before 7:00 and doing punch downs like when the sun-
Kerry Diamond:
What's a punch down?
Samantha Sheehan:
When you're fermenting red wine or some whites, you run it through the destemmer and then you put the grapes into if it's like a small fermentation into a macro bin or into a tank. Then, as the fermentation starts, the CO2 pushes the skins up and you call it the cap, and so you have to keep that submerged, not only for extraction, but also for like cleanliness. You use this punch down tool or your feet and-
Kerry Diamond:
Like I Love Lucy?
Samantha Sheehan:
... basically... Yeah, just like I Love Lucy, and you basically like punch the top down.
Kerry Diamond:
People still do use their feet?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
That's a think? Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
I do all the time, mostly because I'm lazy and it's like really easy just to kind of climb in and... but stomp, you now, it's like a really good ab and arm workout to do punch downs.
Kerry Diamond:
Do you have very soft feet? This is the weirdest question I've ever asked on Radio Cherry Bombe, everybody, but do you have really soft feet because of that?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah? I would just imagine like the wine not, I don't know something happens there.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. No, I think because I don't really go barefoot very often. I have soft feet.
Kerry Diamond:
Thank you for answering that question. Okay, so that's a punch down. When did you transition to having your own company?
Samantha Sheehan:
Actually, the first year because I realized-
Kerry Diamond:
Ooh, that was fast.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, well, I realized that with my $36,000 salary and my schedule of working 7:00 AM until 2:00 AM seven days a week, I was only making $8 an hour, and so I called that owner of the winery and I said, "Hey, you know, I realized I'm only making $7 with this set of signal and I was working with all these men. They were experienced and they knew how much they should make and what the hours would be like. They were making $20 an hour and then 40 in overtime, and then 80 in double overtime. I felt like I was always like running around like cleaning up. I was like, "Why am I not getting the same salary? I called the owner and I said, "Hey, I realized that I'm making $7 an hour and that's like pretty far below minimum wage. Everybody else here is making 20, 40, and 80."
The owner of the winery kind of panicked and I think he thought I was going to sue him. I said, "Can I just make some wine here for free and trade?" He said, "Absolutely. I'll give you barrels, whatever you need," and that's how I started my brand. I made one barrel of Pinot Noir and one barrel of Chardonnay.
Kerry Diamond:
Was that very brave for you at the time? Or were you just the kind of person who you were good for asking what you wanted?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, I think I was good at asking-
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... and I just loved wine and I just wanted to try making my own. I think it's because I was working with all these Cabernet producers and they were making... I mean, they were getting tons of accolades, they were getting hundred-point scores. They were selling their wines for $200, and all I wanted to do was make natural wine, I mean, like very clean, kind of classic style of wine, but I didn't want to do all of these like technical winemaking methods, and so I kind of wanted to explore.
Kerry Diamond:
You wanted to get into your beloved category of sparkling?
Samantha Sheehan:
Mm-hmm. Yes, which is the worst business model.
Kerry Diamond:
No. Tell me.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. Well, so I make a Blanc de Blanc, POE and Ultraviolet are the two brands I started with. POE is the brand that I made the champagne method, sparkling wine. Chardonnay, Sparkling Rose, Pinot Noir and Pinot Meunier, and that was really like my love.
Kerry Diamond:
Pinot Meunier?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, so in champagne, the three main varietals are Pinot Noir, Chardonnay and Pinot Meunier, and so I make a red... I make a lot of Pinot Meunier. I make a Pet-Nat style, a Sparkling, and a red-
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... and a Piquette for champagne, the three main varietals are Pinot, no Chardonnay and Pinot min. And so I make a red, I make a lot of Pinot Meunier I make a pet style, a sparkling and a red-
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... and a Piquette for Gin Polka.
Kerry Diamond:
What's a Piquette?
Samantha Sheehan:
It actually means shit wine in French and it's not legal to sell in France. It's basically like the workers' wine.-
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... so you take grape skins that have maybe already been used for something and then you add water and ferment it, and so the alcohol's very low.
Kerry Diamond:
Huh. Oh, okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
Like 5 to 9%.
Kerry Diamond:
Is there a big difference taste-wise?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, it, I mean, it's definitely very light-
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... in style because it has like 50% water.
Kerry Diamond:
But if you're looking for something lighter, low APV-
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, like light and refreshing, a good lunch wine, and so that's sort of how the vineyard workers use it. They'll drink it for lunch.
Kerry Diamond:
Got it. Okay, and you mentioned Pet-Nat. I know there's still a lot of confusion out there with natural wines, that whole category. What is a Pet-Nat?
Samantha Sheehan:
To me, it's petillant naturel. I'm terrible with French-
Kerry Diamond:
It's okay-
Samantha Sheehan:
... for sure, but-
Kerry Diamond:
... we won't judge. My French is terrible.
Samantha Sheehan:
It just means a wine that is naturally sparkling, and so typically what you do is you ferment juice down to a certain bricks and then you put it into bottle and let it finish.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us what a bricks is, too.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, that's a measurement of sugar, so how much sugar is in the grapes or in the juice and so you let it finish fermentation naturally inside of a bottle, but you can also do it inside of a tank, and the natural gas from the fermentation is what causes the carbonation.
Kerry Diamond:
I love Pet-Nats.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, good.
Kerry Diamond:
I don't know if I'm just buying into the trendiness of Pet-Nats or I truly love Pet-Bats, but sparkling is my thing. I think I've told you that.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
From sparkling water to spritzes to champagne, I love anything sparkling.
Samantha Sheehan:
I'm the same way. Well, the fun thing about up Pet-Nats, because it's like the first fermentation, they're usually pretty young. There's a lot of like fruity character-
Kerry Diamond:
You can drink them right away?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, and you can also pick them later, so for champagne method sparkling, because you have two fermentations, you end up picking up an extra percent and a half of alcohol during the champagne, you know, the sparkling fermentation. You have to pick it really early, like a much lower alcohol. Whereas Pet-Nat, you can pick it basically with more sugar than you would pick a champagne method, and so you have like more fruit character than in a champagne method wine.
Kerry Diamond:
You start with POE and Ultraviolet. Did you start with two brands out of the gate?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, yeah. I started with POE and Ultraviolet in '09, and my aunt did the first label. She lives in Morristown, New Jersey. Then, I met Michael, who's my husband, in 2010, and the first thing he did was change my label. He was really worried that like my mother and my aunt would be mad at him for changing it, so it was like kind of a little bit of family drama, although they really weren't at all. They were upset because the label that he designed was beautiful. Michael is a label designer. He's probably done 600 wine labels. He did the Matthiasson labels, probably the one that people know the most, and Favia, which is actually at Morrell right across the way here.
Kerry Diamond:
Here. We have the Morrell wine shop right across from where we record our podcast.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
I love wine labels. I will admit, I have bought lots of wine based on the label. I'm sure your husband loves that.
Samantha Sheehan:
He would be happy to hear that.
Kerry Diamond:
You do two brands, right, out of the gate? That's ambitious.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. Yeah. I just wanted to explore and I think that's what led me to Mommenpop and just sort of always trying new things and making different wines. I just want to make what I want to drink. Like really, it always starts with, "I would like to drink this, so I'm going to make it," and I just figured that if no one buys it, then I'll drink it all myself. Also-
Kerry Diamond:
That's funny.
Samantha Sheehan:
... not not be the best business model, but...
Kerry Diamond:
No, we... Sam's a good business person. We'll get up to that later. How do you figure out distribution for the brands?
Samantha Sheehan:
I met a couple who had a brokerage in California at a party, a wine tasting, and they were like, "We'd like to sell your wine," and so-
Kerry Diamond:
Brokerage is the term for someone who does wine distribution?
Samantha Sheehan:
In California, you're allowed to have a broker or a distributor because you can sell direct in California, and so a distributor buys your product from you and they like take possession of it and then they sell it, and a broker, you still have possession of your product, and then they get a commission from the sales. They were a broker-
Kerry Diamond:
Then, you decided to go the broker route?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. I was like, who's going to buy my wine? I've never made wine before. I've only been doing this for a year. I was just really impressed somebody would sell it.
Kerry Diamond:
People wanted to buy it.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. They sold it all. It was about 45 cases and they sold all of it in like three weeks. It was amazing.
Kerry Diamond:
What did that tell you?
Samantha Sheehan:
Like, "I think I can do this. I think I can."
Kerry Diamond:
What was the reaction to the wine? I know wine reviews are a big deal.
Samantha Sheehan:
I think like the buyers, restaurants, and stores were excited that there was a new brand by someone who was young. I think at the time there were a lot of like big Cabernets sort of coming out of Napa. I mean, there were, of course, like some cool smaller producers, but maybe not as many then. I mean, Steve Matthiasson and Jill were definitely doing... A lot of people whose wines they love were there, but yeah, people are just really supportive.
Kerry Diamond:
What would you say is the signature of your wines?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
You wanted something that wasn't out there.
Samantha Sheehan:
Mm-hmm. Yeah, I try to work with vineyards that are family owned. Families are really involved in the farming and most of the vineyards are farmed organically, and so all of the wines, and most of the vineyards are farmed organically. All of the wines, again, because they're wines that I drink, I just want to make sure that they come from organically farmed vineyards and there's nothing added and the wines are just clean and natural.
Kerry Diamond:
For those out there who have always dreamed of having their own wine or making their own wine, you don't necessarily have to own a vineyard?
Samantha Sheehan:
No, you can either commit to buy tonnage of grapes, so you can say, I'd like to buy five tons from you this year," or you can at least like have long-term leases with Rose, which is what I do, so-
Kerry Diamond:
You have your own rose and a vineyard?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, that's exciting.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, yeah, which is great because then you can really see like the year-to-year differences, like the vintage differences, and then you can have like complete control over the farming.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us what Mommenpop is and then tell us why you launched Mommenpop.
Samantha Sheehan:
Mommenpop is our citrus aperitif brand. We make it all in Napa and I launched that brand because I really loved Lillet and I loved Apparel, and I sort of wanted to make our own version of that. Right now, we have three like core flavors. We make ale orange, a Seville orange, a grapefruit, and a blood orange. Then, we have some seasonal flavors that we do, so we make recruit lime, a Meyer Lemon, and a kumquat.
Kerry Diamond:
Yum, and everybody at Jubilee got to try the Meyer lemon one, right?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us about the drink you made for Jubilee.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, we made a Meyer Lemon Spritz, which was so much fun. It was our Meyer Lemon Aperitif, and then we added a little bit of sparkling Pellegrino, and some Prosecco.
Kerry Diamond:
You had the prettiest activation. Thank you so much for building that gorgeous bar. Tell us a sec about that bar.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, thank you. Yeah-
Kerry Diamond:
That was all citrus skin in the front? I mean-
Samantha Sheehan:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
... that was mind-blowing.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, so my husband Michael wanted to have the front panel CNC meld, and we have a friend who has a design studio in Brooklyn, and so when they plugged the citrus pulp pattern into the computer that does a CNC milling, it froze. I think there was just like too much detail in the pulp. Michael was like, you know, it was two weeks before the event. He was like, "We have to figure this out," and so he poured this giant silicone like rectangle and he took a razor blade and curved it. Then, he carved a citrus pulp pattern into the silicone, and then I helped him with this part. This is really fun.
We poured this like resin into the silicone mold, and then we peeled the mold off. We had these two nine-feet, I think, rectangle resin castings of citrus pulp. We essentially like attached one to each side of the booth, and then poured strung Meyer lemons. There's a really cool distillery called Matchbook Distilling and they connected me with one of their growers out here and they hooked us up with like 700 pounds of Meyer lemons, which we strung from the top of the booth. We're going to give those to Matchbook to use for distilling after.
Kerry Diamond:
I love that. No food waste folks.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
You will have those two panels forever.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
I mean, you could hang those over a fireplace or something. They've very cool looking.
Samantha Sheehan:
We're going to make a door for our office. Oh, I love that.
Kerry Diamond:
What do you wish you knew back then that you know today?
Samantha Sheehan:
I always thought I could do everything myself, and so for about 10 years I had zero employees, and then this year, we brought on quite a few people. Now, we have nine people for Mommenpop. In like one year, we brought everybody on and it's amazing.
Kerry Diamond:
Now, you have two kids-
Samantha Sheehan:
Mm-hmm.
Kerry Diamond:
... So doing all that on your own for 10 years, that's a lot.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. It was kind of crazy. I have a two-year-old and a six-year-old.
Kerry Diamond:
Let's talk finances a little bit. How have you funded the company all these years?
Samantha Sheehan:
Just with proceeds from sales, so self-funded.
Kerry Diamond:
You never got over your skis in terms of what you were making doing?
Samantha Sheehan:
No, I was always like very conservative about it. I only made what I knew that I could sell and then just put the profits back into the business, which meant not paying myself a salary for a few years. It was great because I learned every like aspect [crosstalk 00:22:57] of this business-
Kerry Diamond:
Did you have savings? You told us how much you were making at Deloitte, and I'm like, "Wow, I should have studied accounting-
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah..
Kerry Diamond:
... "in college."
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, yeah, but it's -
Kerry Diamond:
Did you have your Deloitte money saved? Did you-
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, Deloitte money saved first few years. I consulted for other wineries on the side, and so that was what paid sort of my living expenses while I built the business on the side-
Kerry Diamond:
Got it. Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... in tandem.
Kerry Diamond:
How did you have the funds to hire nine people?
Samantha Sheehan:
You know, Ultraviolet has grown quite a bit, and so right now that business is essentially helping to grow Mommenpop.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell me some of your goals for the company.
Samantha Sheehan:
I feel that there's so much potential with Mommenpop, especially after being out here. We've had a lot of like bartenders get really excited about it and restaurants and so-
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, right, oh right. We served it at the Julia Child dinner that we did to celebrate the launch of the HBO Max Julia series and people loved it.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, that's so great. Yeah. I just would really love to see it in like more bars and restaurants and in more people's hands.
Kerry Diamond:
I love a spritz. It's going to be my go-to this summer.
Samantha Sheehan:
That's awesome. I mean, it's so fun to make. I'm really excited about all of like the vineyards that we're working with and like the small farmers that we're supporting. Now, working with citrus, we have those like same types of relationships. We have a number of citrus growers that we're working with in California and they're just like so excited to have an outlet for their produce and to see it being used in this way. It just feels really good to be like supporting these farmers and to have them as partners. Yeah, I would just love to see more people enjoying it. That's like the whole pleasure of this business is seeing people consuming your product.
Kerry Diamond:
Now. we know about your accounting side, we know about your science side. How about you as a creative? How do you exercise that side of your brain?
Samantha Sheehan:
I think it's more about keeping that in control because I'm always wanting to make new products and always try new things. The first person to stop me is Michael, my husband because he's like, "Okay, Sam, if you decide, you know, if you come out with a new product, then I'm going to have to design the label and the packaging." He's the first stop, and then our sales team is our second stop because they're like, "Sam, there's a lot of setup work that goes into this."
Kerry Diamond:
What is your advice to other entrepreneurs now that you've been doing this for so long?
Samantha Sheehan:
I think it's always just to talk to as many people as you can and get as much advice as you can. With a lot of things, you have to learn it yourself, but just really talking to people that you respect is so key because I learned everything in terms of winemaking and Mommenpop just by asking a lot of questions and just being like really open to advice and not being afraid to ask questions. People are so supportive and it feels like everybody in this industry just wants to support each other, and it doesn't feel competitive, which is incredible.
Kerry Diamond:
That surprises me because I wouldn't have assumed there was space for a young woman changing careers with no wine background to come in and do what you've done because you've made a name for yourself.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, thank you. I've only ever had one person say no to a piece of information that I asked and that was a winemaker. It was my favorite winery in Burgundy. I was telling the owner how much I loved his wine and I asked him if he would tell me what barrels he used and he said no. Then, he invited me to the winery. He's like, "Well, if you'd ever like to come, here's my card." I said, "Great, I'm going to walk around and like look at all of the barrels." He said, "Oh, we sand off the names." I was like, "You have a ground crew vineyard in Burgundy, like the most beautiful, most famous vineyard in the world. I could never recreate that wine even if I had the same barrels."
That was kind of funny and I remember it so well because it was literally the only time somebody said no. So many people like Steve Matthiasson and Dan Petroski, if I have a question, I'll just call them on the spot in the middle of my problem and they always answer the phone and they always tell me everything from like their own experience and from what they've read or what they've learned. It's incredible. People are just so... I think it's because we all love what we do and we also know that somebody can't like recreate exactly what we're doing, but even without that, I just think that people are really passionate about their careers and about this industry. People love having relationships with each other, so everyone's always just really free with their information and advice.
Kerry Diamond:
It sounds like you've never had imposter syndrome.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, all the time/
Kerry Diamond:
You do?
Samantha Sheehan:
Literally every single day.
Kerry Diamond:
It hasn't stopped you.
Samantha Sheehan:
No, I think I'm also very stubborn and really optimistic, so I always assume I'll figure out a way [crosstalk 00:27:46]-
Kerry Diamond:
Stubborn and optimistic. Those are two interesting traits.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. No, all the time, Like, "Are people going to realize that my wines aren't good enough?" Or, yeah, constantly, but I think you just have to kind of like barrel through it.
Kerry Diamond:
No pun intended.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
What are your dreams for your brands?
Samantha Sheehan:
For Mommenpop and Ultraviolet, because those are two brands that we're really growing, just to be in every single restaurant, every single one. I mean, of course, yeah, just to really grow them and have people enjoying them, like truly enjoying them, and then POE will always be small. So-
Kerry Diamond:
POE's your baby.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yes. Yeah. Those are wines that come from small vineyards and we'll never be able to make a lot of those, so...
Kerry Diamond:
Do you want to have your own physical winery one day?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. I think my dream would be having a winery that's broken out into two parts, and so the back would be Mommenpop and we would have a citrus grove with all these esoteric citrus varietals, and we would have all the botanicals that we use in Mommenpop and like a little tasting area where we could do seasonal spritzes and seasonal flavors and be able to cook and serve food pairings. Then, maybe the front would be all for sparkling winemaking. so we'd have riddling racks and all of our bottles on tirage. Yeah, it would be fun.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh my gosh. I can totally envision that. I mean, as you were talking about it, I see some dogs and cats maybe. too.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. As long as they stay off the tables.
Kerry Diamond:
Are you not an animal person?
Samantha Sheehan:
No. I love animals.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh you do? Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, we have-
Kerry Diamond:
It's hard to keep the cats off the tables.
Samantha Sheehan:
We have lurcher. She would keep the cats off the tables.
Kerry Diamond:
What's a lurcher?
Samantha Sheehan:
A lurcher, it's a breed from the 1500s.
Kerry Diamond:
It's a dog?
Samantha Sheehan:
A dog, a dog breed. It's not an officially recognized breed, but if you go to London or Ireland, everybody knows exactly what a lurcher is. In like the 1500s, only the royalty were allowed to hunt on the Royal hunting grounds and like the upper class, and so they'd breed Greyhounds for racing and deer hounds for hunting. Occasionally, they'd cross breed and they'd throw out the puppies and the puppies would interbreed with terriers, and then they would use these crossbred dogs for poaching on like the Royal hunting grounds. They called them the lurcher, which actually-
Kerry Diamond:
Aah-
Samantha Sheehan:
... means a mixed breed thief-
Kerry Diamond:
Oh-
Samantha Sheehan:
... which is interesting.
Kerry Diamond:
... I didn't know that.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
I was thinking Lurch from the Addams Family.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Okay, I'm going to look up lurchers. The lurchers will keep the cats away. All right.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, she's the most beautiful dog. She can-
Kerry Diamond:
Oh.
Samantha Sheehan:
... like six feet, so she can clear these giant hedges.
Kerry Diamond:
Would love to know some tools that you rely on as an entrepreneur.
Samantha Sheehan:
We've been using Mailchimp for 11 years. It's great. QuickBooks, I guess that's the-
Kerry Diamond:
Oh.
Samantha Sheehan:
... accountant in me. I love downloading reports and just seeing how sales are going and projecting our sales throughout the year. Then, we use QuickBooks Payroll, which is amazing, and we us Slack as well.
Kerry Diamond:
You do? Yeah, we love Slack.
Samantha Sheehan:
Mm-hmm. We use-
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah.
Samantha Sheehan:
... Basecamp for our marketing.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell me about Basecamp. I don't know about Basecamp.
Samantha Sheehan:
It's a great place for like communicating and sort of keeping those like work communications organized, and then also we can-
Kerry Diamond:
You mean with like third parties?
Samantha Sheehan:
Just internally, but then-
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... you can also use it for contractors. You can have like groups that contractors have access to.
Kerry Diamond:
How is that different from Slack?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. Basecamp, you can assign like tasks to people-
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
... and then it reminds them, and then you can sort of like tick the box when it's done, which is great.
Kerry Diamond:
What's next for you?
Samantha Sheehan:
Like today? Or in life in general?
Kerry Diamond:
Anything. Today and in life.
Samantha Sheehan:
As soon as I get back to Napa, we're going to start sort of like working on our... Well, first we're bottling, so I to get back tonight, which is Monday, and then this entire week, we're going to spend putting our blends together for Mommenpop, and then next week we're bottling. We're bottling our Seville orange and our blood orange flavors. Then, we're bottling our Paloma, which is awesome. It's a little 187 champagne bottle with the crown cap that we're making Paloma in and carbonating it, so it's like a little ready-to-drink cocktail. Then, we have a bunch of fun like summer events planned, so I'm really excited.
Kerry Diamond:
That's fun. Are they mostly in Napa?
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah. All in California.
Kerry Diamond:
Okay.
Samantha Sheehan:
This is the only one that we're doing out of state, and I thought it was a little crazy that the first event we were doing as a team was not only not in California, but completely across the country, but I could not turn down Cherry Bombe.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh-
Samantha Sheehan:
It's like-
Kerry Diamond:
Oh.
Samantha Sheehan:
... the one event we wanted to do this year.
Kerry Diamond:
Thank you for being part of Jubilee. It was a really special day and it was just so lovely seeing everyone together again, and I appreciate your support and you taking care of everybody on Saturday for us.
Samantha Sheehan:
Oh, we loved being a part of it. I mean, everyone was just so lovely. I enjoyed like every conversation I had with every person. I was like, "Will you be my friend? Will you be my friend? Will you be my friend?" I mean, it was just such a great group of women.
Kerry Diamond:
You are the best, Sam. Thank you so much for your support and for joining us, and I'm going to major FOMO seeing these events out in Napa and California. I need to-
Samantha Sheehan:
Come out.
Kerry Diamond:
... I need to get out there. It's been a while, but it would be blast.
Samantha Sheehan:
Yeah, come out and visit us.
Kerry Diamond:
Absolutely.
Kerry Diamond:
That's it for today's show. Thank you so much to Samantha Sheehan for joining me. Want to support Samantha? Check out the websites for her three brands, POE Wines, Ultraviolet Wines, and Mommenpop. Or, ask for them at your favorite wine shop or restaurant. Sam's brand new wine for Foxtrot Market, Mouthy, is available at foxtrotco.com. Thank you to Cambozola for supporting today's show. Sign up for their beach vacation giveaway at this isfinecheese.com. Thank you to the Law Firm of Helbraun Levy. Visit helbraunlevy.com for a free consultation.
Radio Cherry Bombe is a production of Cherry Bombe Magazine. Our theme song is by the band Tra La La. Thank you, Joseph Hazan, Studio Engineer for Newsstand Studios at Rockefeller Center, and thank you to our Assistant Producer, Jenna Sadhu, and thanks to you for listening. You are the Bombe.