Liza Colón-Zayas Transcript
Kerry Diamond:
Hi, everyone. You are listening to Radio Cherry Bombe, and I'm your host, Kerry Diamond, coming to you from Newsstand Studios at Rockefeller Center in the heart of New York City. I'm the founder and editor of Cherry Bombe Magazine and each week I talk to the most interesting women and culinary creatives in and around the world of food. I'm so excited about today's episode.
My guest is Liza Colón-Zayas, who plays Tina on “The Bear,” the critically acclaimed hit series on Hulu. I'm so honored to interview Liza. You can't help but root for her character, Tina, as she navigates the restaurant world, culinary school, and her devotion to Carmy, his late brother and the rest of the crew. If you're a fan of “The Bear,” you know that Liza is positively luminous as Tina. Liza is an accomplished theater actor and a devoted New Yorker. She's had an amazing journey with lots of ups and some downs, and because it's December, we're also talking how to host with the most. So I chat with Liza about her favorite holiday traditions, foods and memories. Stay tuned.
Today's episode is supported by Kerrygold. The holidays are here and Kerrygold wants to help you make life more festive and delicious with its beautiful butter and cheese made with milk from Irish grass-fed cows. If you are baking, and I hope you are, be sure to stock up on Kerrygold pure Irish butter. Kerrygold's unsalted sticks are always in my fridge for whatever I need to whip up, cookies, cakes, biscuits, or some pie dough. Switching to savory for a sec, if you want to impress folks at mealtime try Kerrygold's new butter blends. These compound butters are perfectly on trend and are great slathered on bread, tossed with some roasted veggies or melted on top of a baked potato. Try Kerrygold Butter Blends in sun-dried tomato and basil, bell pepper and garden herbs or chive and onion. I'm sure you can think of a million ways to use them. And then it's not a holiday without a cheeseboard. If you are a longtime listener, you know I absolutely love Kerrygold Cashel Blue Farmhouse Cheese. It's my favorite blue ever. There are lots of other Kerrygold cheeses to explore and adore, including the classic Kerrygold Reserve Cheddar and the Gouda-style Blarney cheese. Add some crackers, I love those ones with dried fruit nuts in them, you know the ones, maybe some jam or honey and a little jar, decorate with a few sprigs of rosemary and there you go, a perfect cheeseboard. That's definitely one way to host with the most. For more on Kerrygold, visit kerrygoldusa.com where you can find great recipes, product information, and a store locator. That's kerrygoldusa.com.
Don't miss the new holiday issue of Cherry Bombe's print magazine with culinary superstar, Molly Baz on the cover and a special Molly Baz poster on the inside. The issue also features profiles on your fave foodies and creatives, lots of hosting tips and delicious recipes perfect for your holiday gatherings. We even have a story with Liza Colón-Zayas about celebrating the holidays with her family. Pick up a copy at a retailer near you, like my local Books Are Magic in Brooklyn, Heath Newsstand in San Francisco, and Bank News in Cleveland. Check out cherrybombe.com for our complete list of retailers. You know, what would make a great gift? The Molly Baz issue plus Molly's new cookbook. How about that? I might have to gift that to a few folks on my list.
All right, everybody enjoy my chat with Liza. Liza Colón-Zayas, welcome to Radio Cherry Bombe.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Thank you. Thank you for having me.
Kerry Diamond:
Let's jump right in. When you first learned about “The Bear” and the role of Tina, what did you think?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I didn't know anything about it. I was sent a couple of pages, so I didn't read a script. I didn't know if the person I was speaking opposite Sydney, I thought Sydney was like a blonde Barbie. I had no idea. And it was during COVID, so it was a tape. So I'm self taping in a bedroom and they dug it, yada yada. I booked the pilot, so it was just a pilot then. Obviously the pilot episode one, we don't know much about Tina at all, and so not having cooked in a professional kitchen, I was lost and there was one day where I went into a pizza joint and it was mostly all these men front and back, and then this little woman walked out, little Latina woman walked out and they snapped too. I don't even remember what she said. She just barked a couple of things and they were like, "She went right back." And I was like, "That's Tina. I don't know what she's doing. I don't know anything, but thank you." So that's where Tina started.
Kerry Diamond:
I read that pizza place was in Midtown. Do you remember which pizza place it is?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I don't remember.
Kerry Diamond:
Because I feel like they need a plaque that says this is where Tina was born.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yes, yes.
Kerry Diamond:
So we can make a pilgrimage.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Okay, I got to go on a mission.
Kerry Diamond:
If you spot it again, let us know the address. When you get hired to do the pilot, there's no guarantee the pilot's getting picked up.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No, no. I just knew that we were having so much fun. A lot of the actors have theater background and it was a great script. Chris Storer, Joanna Calo, they're just fun and open and that permeates the whole set, the crew, the cast, and we just had fun.
Kerry Diamond:
So you had a sense it would be picked up.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I didn't get a sense. When I saw it edited, I didn't realize how dark and stressful it would be because we're going through it and then it's cut and we're cracking up. We're laughing. It doesn't feel heavy until it does, but it doesn't... For the most part, this is the pilot, so I didn't know. And then we saw the rough cut. He sent us a rough cut a couple months later and my husband, who's an actor, David Zayas is from Dexter and was a retired cop, we're watching it and at the end he was like, "Yo, this was really good, but it would stress me out." He has seen some things, but I thought, "Okay, it's so specific it's not going to have a wide reach. It's great, but it's shocking, shocking."
Kerry Diamond:
So who was Tina to you in the beginning? Did you develop a backstory for her?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I try to avoid that. I trust that there was very little information given because I feel like they wanted to see how I rolled and distill that and I was like, "Let me just play what's on the page." Of course, there's got to be a deeper familiarity and I think I had that because she's a Frankenstein of the women in my life. I drew from that. I didn't want to paint myself into a corner with pushing it and I learned to just trust them. They know what they're doing.
Kerry Diamond:
Right, because she evolved so much over the two seasons.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
She does. She does. And I cannot take credit for that. I feel like Chris and Joanna, Renee, those writers, they are profound and special and they paid attention and they pulled things out of me that I didn't know I had in me. I don't sing. I sing in the shower and they push me in that scene to... All right, I don't want to give anything away.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, that's okay. The karaoke scene.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
I'm shocked to learn you don't sing.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No.
Kerry Diamond:
You had such a beautiful voice in that scene.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Thank you. It worked, my strategy worked.
Kerry Diamond:
Well, you're an actor.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I'm an actor, and so I was really freaked out and Chris said that it's not about the perfection of it. It's about the vulnerability and that symbolizing the risk taking. I'm like, "Okay, I got to sing this song. I remember this song, but why this song?" And they knew what they were doing.
Kerry Diamond:
You did work in restaurants, not extensively, but tell us your experience.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No. Okay. It's really limited, so I'm not trying to want to be seasoned waitress or anything, guys. First, I was working the counter at a donut shop in the 70s and I thought it was really cool because it was in the village and it was the 70s, so that was my first overtime in college. I washed dishes, so I had to be up at the crack of dawn to be on the dish line. After that, I worked counter and this place, I remember it was called the Great American Deli or something. That was rough.
Kerry Diamond:
Where was that?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
That was over here down the block from the public library. I got in trouble because I didn't realize it was kosher and I brought in a donut from Dunkin' Donuts and I got in trouble. I wasn't a very good waitress. I also waited tables at this little Italian restaurant upstate in Albany where I went to college and I spilled things. I got orders wrong all the time. I was a catastrophe. Anyway, all of these things, which how I ended up as Tina, it's amazing, but I am familiar with trying to survive, struggling to get things right and learn. And so I think that's what Tina's trying to do. She's rough around the edges and I understand trying to go to the next level.
Kerry Diamond:
You said she's a mix of a lot of women in your life over the years and you so kindly wrote about your grandmother for us, and we'll talk a little bit about her on the holidays, but as soon as you said that, I was like, "Ph, Tina reminds me a little bit of her grandmother." Because you, in the story, said everyone called your grandmother the general.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Well, thankfully we, the grandchildren, didn't get to have to see that side, but we felt it with our uncles and my dad. She ran a tight ship and she came to this country in 1919 by boat. Back then, Puerto Ricans, they would land in Brooklyn and then she ended up in Chelsea and working factories and she had eight children. I don't know how she did it. It was a railroad apartment. There would be just endless amount of relatives rolling through all day and somehow she would just open that little tiny stove, just slice person by person, the lechon, the penne, the roast pork shoulder. And she would, for every person, she would just slice one plate at a time, serve one plate at a time where I'm like, "Ah, restaurant, put all the silverware down, que siento." And I lose my mind. And she just was like, boom, planted and everything was amazing.
And so it's a little bit of her and my other grandmother who I didn't get to talk to you about. I didn't like food. Now I like food too much. But when I was a kid, it was really hard to get me to eat and she would just, I don't know, it felt like within minutes she would roll out dough and get me to eat all kind of incredible empanadas that she would just roll the dough and fry things up. And Farina wasn't the Farina we knew here. It's a mixture with egg yolk and brown sugar and vanilla and it's incredible. And she just figured out ways between the two of them to get me to eat, which I didn't want to eat. And that's how the women showed their love. That's how it was done.
My aunt who was hardcore, hardcore Sunday brunch and it wasn't called brunch. It was just like you come over on Sunday and you eat, it was fried pork chops and these frittatas with avocado and tostones. It was just what you did right after you watch Abbott and Costello, whatever, you sit down at the table and we ate and listened to music. So those women, they were very, I don't know how, there's no way, but they're a combination of them and my girl from Upper East Side.
Kerry Diamond:
So “The Bear” debuts kind of quietly in June '22 and becomes a huge hit culturally. You were surprised.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah. This is the dream, right? I'm hustling for decades, struggling actor. Then I've resigned myself that maybe it's not going to be what I dreamed about, but I'm good. I'm still getting great opportunities. I'm going to go to Broadway and I've done a lot of really significant theater in New York and awards, and so it just doesn't look like the fantasy that 98% of the actors don't realize either. And then this happens and I'm like, "It's a fluke." And then we get a second season and I'm like, "Well, okay." I will never be casual about it. I know what it's like to hustle and hustle and have something evaporate or get so close and have it go away. But it's the dream to not only have all of those things aligned, great writing, great cast. No one is a jackass. There's nobody that I'm like, "Oh, I hope this one..."
And it just keeps getting better. And then Jamie Lee Curtis rolls in and you saw the cameos in the second season, and I'm still pinching myself because that is beyond where my dream was going because you got that dream as a kid and then you see the realities. And even if it looks all hunky-dory on the outside, and it's never always as perfect as even how I'm making it sound, but it's pretty close. There's always somebody or something that just has to ruin a good time. And so far that's not been this situation. And I'm always waiting for the other shoe to drop, but it hasn't happened yet. So this is beyond.
Kerry Diamond:
Beyond your expectations, I'm happy to hear that.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Thank you.
Kerry Diamond:
And I know this is the question everyone wants you to have an answer for, but why do you think the show has resonated the way it has?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Because it's true to a lived experience. I don't think anything about it is trying to find a cheap, easy way to manipulate the audience emotionally. It's about the truth and humanizing these people, so you're going to get it all if they adhere and I think they are.
Kerry Diamond:
So interesting that folks in the hospitality world love it to the extent that they do because it rings so true. But then folks who've never worked in hospitality love the show.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
People approach me whether it's a 20 something Latino who's like, "Oh man, you're my mom. You're just like my mom. I love Tina." What I never expect to hear is I love Tina because she's such a hardhat. I guess as long as people continue to respect the authenticity and the culinary craft.
Kerry Diamond:
Let's go a little deeper with Tina because you can't help but just actively be rooting for Tina every second of the show. Aside from that young woman you referenced, what is everyone responding to with Tina?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
What I'm hearing a lot is the most basic way is the shift in the comradery with her and Sydney. They love that. And I think, yeah, of course, having comradery between women instead of always having to be competition. Tina's emotional reaction to a dream. I relate to that. Like I said, I had given up on I'm reaching this level. I had given up on it. And so that was an organic reaction in that scene. Chris doesn't like to do a lot of retakes, a couple, and so he was real happy with that. But I feel like, yeah, when I got this pilot, I think people seeing somebody of a certain age, especially a woman, somebody who typically is invisible in our society, the person you ride with the subway with.
Kerry Diamond:
I read in other interviews you've done, you talk about rejection a lot, and you've said you've been rejected more than a thousand times. How have you learned to live with that?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
You just have, you just have to. If it's what you really want to do and I can't do anything else, I got no other skills.
Kerry Diamond:
You tried waiting tables.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I tried waiting tables. I was a teaching artist, but I knew I had very limited energy, but I knew I had something special. That is something that whether it was delusional, I was going to hold onto that. Plus I was getting enough confirmation from people I respected to keep fighting the fight. You got to know when to find other hobbies that make you happy and feed your soul and get therapy, coño, get therapy. It doesn't make you a better artist to be constantly suffering and wallowing in your agony. It doesn't. It takes you further away from the craft and from having a well-rounded life, which is what you need to be able to access if you're going to be that kind of artist. So I learned that eventually.
And I'm not saying I didn't do that for... Many, many pity parties, many, you can't believe that you only get one shot. No, you don't. It's a great song, but it's not the truth. There will be other things and you'll grow and you'll get older. And we don't come with an expiration date, although that's what they make you think. You get better and you got to get better at believing in yourself, and you got to get better at taking care of yourself and finding other things that bring you joy because even if it's not directly related to the industry, it will be.
Kerry Diamond:
You kind of answered my next question. You've been very honest about the racism and the sexism and the ageism that you've had to endure in the industry. And I was going to say, how have you dealt with that? But I think you just gave the answer.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, I think it's changing. I was told that we have reached parody in theater. I don't have all the-
Kerry Diamond:
We're going to talk all about your theater career because you've had such an amazing-
Liza Colón-Zayas:
So I'm saying, yes, we have a long way to go, but I feel, for me, it's still part of the same thing. We have to deprogram ourselves from being inferior. And that's the thing about systemic racism and misogyny is that it's brilliant. It's set up to last generations. And so millennial-
Kerry Diamond:
Learning.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah. So yeah, if you're feeling like you're not beautiful enough or interesting enough or anything enough, learn your history, learn who you come from. You don't know it, not because we didn't build this country and this world. It's because there is active erasure of our power. Learn about it. That's what I felt like. Oh, sisters, learn your history. If you want to know the history of this country, what was it Tony Morrison said, you don't know the history of this country unless you know the stories of Black and brown women. So learn it and stand in your power.
Kerry Diamond:
We'll be right back. Today's episode is also sponsored by Sanpellegrino. There's no better way to add some sparkle to your holiday table than with premium sparkling water from Sanpellegrino, the unique balance of effervescence and rich minerality cleanse the palette and amplify subtle flavors, making it the perfect compliment to find food and wines and the cherry on top, we love how the iconic green bottles make any tablescape look festive and bright for the holiday season. Looking for a mocktail to add to your holiday party? Sanpellegrino Italian sparkling drinks are a beautiful way to add some bubbles to your non-alcoholic sips. We even used the Aranciata flavor to create a special non-alcoholic drink called Bomb Squad Bubbles at our mentor mentee dinner last month with blood orange, cherry and Sanpellegrino's Aranciata Italian sparkling drink. It was the perfect way to raise a glass in celebration of women in the world of food and drink. For more on Sanpellegrino, visit sanpellegrino.com. You can find great recipes for delicious sips, product information and more. That's sanpellegrino.com.
I read that you only got your first recurring TV role in 2019. Is that true?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
In “Treatment,” yes. That was the longer ongoing recurring. Before that on “Law and Order Special Victims Unit,” it was two episodes, the same character and then a follow-up. So I guess technically that was my recurrent. Yeah, it took that long. It took that long.
Kerry Diamond:
Does that just go back to the systemic problems with the industry or because you were in theater?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, I think it's a combination of a lot of things.
Kerry Diamond:
Or in New York, is it harder in New York City because you're not in Hollywood?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No, Hollywood is not easier. For me, it wasn't. I feel like because there is a respect for theater here, then there is a wider scope of humanity, and so the casting people see that. Art is a tricky thing. When it clicks together and it's the right actor to play that person, you can't quite put it into words. Diversity will change depending on whose stories we want to tell and how diverse those are. But when it doesn't click, it just doesn't click. And we can't take that personally. Maybe you can, but for what? Why punish yourself? You just got to trust that the right thing will find you.
Kerry Diamond:
And how nice that you did get a recurring role in something that is art.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yes, yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
There are lots of fun silly shows, but you're making art.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah. I loved In Treatment before I was on it. I watched all three seasons repeatedly. I watched episodes repeatedly because I was like, "You have two people in a room. There's no special effects. This is theater." And it's wow, so I used to watch and study and then to have booked it, and it just feels like you got to believe. You got to believe that there's a little magic sometimes.
Kerry Diamond:
I feel like you've had roles on everything. I looked at your IMDb page and I was like, "My gosh, this is an encyclopedia of television." “Sex and the City,” “Law and Order,” “Dexter” on and on and on.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
But a lot of things you get cut out of. That's why I don't tell. My mom is like in, "I'm mad at you because you didn't tell me that you was going to be in this television." And I was like, "But ma, I don't set alerts and I don't know, and I never know how much of me they're going to keep." And then with that because then you tell your family and then you get cut out of a lot of stuff. Then they look at you with that disappointed look like, "Oh, well, that's all they gave you?"
Kerry Diamond:
Right, you have no control. It sounds like when you did the pilot for “The Bear,” you had no idea how you tense and tight it was going to be.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
You have no control. Listen, if you want to make great art, you have no control over how people will receive it. Somebody was talking to me recently and they sounded mad about people who constantly end up doing things to get awards. And I'm like, "You got no control. You have no control over who wants to give you a freaking award." You don't pick... Oh yeah, I'm going to get this because... It doesn't work that way. You're lucky you're getting something.
Kerry Diamond:
You've had an incredible theater career, lots of awards, speaking of those awards. Tell us about LAByrinth, because LAByrinth Theater Company's has been a big part of your career here in New York.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, so in 1992, you had to go out and buy a newspaper called Backstage if you didn't have an agent, and it would list open calls. And I saw an article that said, "Excellent Latino Actors Wanted." And I wasn't sure, but I was going to go. So I had to prepare, whatever, get your monologue together, and then callbacks, which meant doing a two person scene. And then you get feedback and then you got to come back and see how you took those notes. So it wasn't an easy get in at that time. And so it was born, LAByrinth stood for LAB, which meant Latino Actors Base at that time because there was a show on Broadway, Death in the Maiden, that was cast, and there was no Latinos. And they said, "Well, because we couldn't find any."
Kerry Diamond:
Shocking.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
In New York City. So in protests, John Ortiz and Gary Perez were like, "We're going to start our own thing." And they talked to Max Ferrá, who ran INTAR, and he had INTAR two, which was basically a rehearsal space in an abandoned theater. And we would meet there weekly to just work on whatever we wanted to work on. And so Sistah Supreme was born out of a writing exercise, write an embarrassing memory.
Kerry Diamond:
And that's your one woman show.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
And that was the birth of it. That one page was when I tried to... I was like, "White people live a different reality, so I'm going to blend in." And it's very tragic, but very funny. So I tried to bleach my hair and my eyebrows and I looked like Bozo because it came out orange. And the sad part is when people would stare at me on the street, I thought it was because I looked so good, and this is what systemic racism will do to a child. And even though I had progressed so past that, by the time I did this writing exercise, I didn't realize how many stories that was going to lead to. And that turned, that one page, into a 90-minute 13 character piece. But then I was like, "Okay, this was therapy." And I worked it out. So I don't need to reopen the scars for the rest of my life.
Kerry Diamond:
So you don't perform it anymore?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No, no. That's in the past. But it was really healing. It was great for me.
Kerry Diamond:
And you went on, you did a lot of other off-Broadway. Broadway.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
A lot of off-Broadway, yeah because I was friends with Stephen Adly Guirgis and Albany State. Stephen Adly Guirgis is a Pulitzer Prize winner. A lot of plays that he wrote, he worked in Philip Seymour Hoffman directed. So I was in eight of Stephen's plays and a bunch of them that Phil directed. Yeah, so almost everything Stephen wrote I was in. He kept validating for me that I had something and Phil kept validating for me that I had something and so here we are.
Kerry Diamond:
You mentioned SUNY Albany again, we need to give a SUNY shout out. I graduated from SUNY Plattsburgh, drove past Albany and took the bus right past Albany every time I went up to school.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, I'm sure.
Kerry Diamond:
We had a little bit more snow than you did, although you probably had your fair amount.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
It was good. I was good. I did not feel deprived with the snow and the cold.
Kerry Diamond:
Why did you want to be an actor? When did you first know?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I always wanted to be, since I was born, it was just something. I used to love to sing the music to Star Trek, and I would sing it all full out. My godfather gave me a little toy piano and I would play it until it broke. And then back in the day, I don't know if you remember “All my Children.”
Kerry Diamond:
I do, all those ABC soap operas, are you kidding?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
So there was this one, Erica Kane, she was all sassy and over the top and fabulous and mean, and I wanted to be Erica Kane. So I would do Erica Kane, and then people would come over and my mom would be like, "Nana, do Erica Kane." I would bust out and start pretending to do Erica Kane monologues, usually arguing with-
Kerry Diamond:
Was that Susan Lucci?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Susan Lucci, the great Susan Lucci, yep. I don't know. It was just in me. I was like, "I'm going to do that. I'm going to play make believe. I'm going to be in the TV world." And then right before I guess I tried to bleach the hair was where I realized I don't see any way of ever being in that Pine Valley world. No one in the Pine Valley world, the TV world, looks like me.
Kerry Diamond:
We’ll be right back. If you are looking for a last minute gift for your favorite food lover, we have some great ideas for you. You can get a gift subscription to Cherry Bombe's print magazine at cherrybombe.com. Your pal will get four issues of our gorgeous magazine in 2024 and free shipping. We also have Cherry Bombe memberships starting at $50. Visit cherrybombe.com for more.
You did have to get a little bit of culinary training to do Tina.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
A little bit.
Kerry Diamond:
Because Tina's skills are a little rough in the first season.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, they're very rough. They're very rough.
Kerry Diamond:
Or not rough, she's just set in her own ways.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, it's the sandwich shop.
Kerry Diamond:
She's done things a certain way.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
A certain way, and the whole environment of the beef is what it is as we see. And so I was very nervous because Ayo and Jeremy, they've been staging at, I think it was Pujol, and I think Sydney was at Wildair, and I didn't have any of that. And they're like, "Jeremy is for real, for real." He's Carmy. And so I like, "Ah." So they sent me to a practice for just five days, and it was real basic, basic with David Waltuck, Founder of Chanterelle. And he was awesome. I love him. But the first day I cut up my fingers.
Kerry Diamond:
Wait, on your stage or on set?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
On my first day at culinary class with David. I had no idea how sharp these knives are that they were so sharp, I didn't feel myself getting sliced. I wish I had sent you the picture of my hands covered in band-aids. And then I was embarrassed, so I'm trying to hide it, and he's notices. He's like, "Yeah, maybe it's good you don't get blood all over the potatoes. Throw it in the trash."
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, no.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, a lot of potatoes. That was five days.
Kerry Diamond:
I just noticed you don't have those scars that all the chefs have.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, I had a few burns. I recently lost the tip right here recently, trying to be cute in front of my husband. I'm like, "Yeah, so ta, cha, cha." He's like, "No." It was this one. It was this one.
Kerry Diamond:
Did you have to go to the hospital?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No. Thankfully it was more nail than actual flesh. So I just wrapped it up real good. And he's like, "Honey, be careful." I'm like, "Oh no, I'm..."
Kerry Diamond:
No emergency room. You're a kitchen badass now.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, so then it grew back.
Kerry Diamond:
Put a bandaid on. Put a glove on.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah. I was nervous because I think we had to go to an award show and I was like, "How am I going to glue this fake nail?"
Kerry Diamond:
Oh no, oh no. But season two, you go to culinary school, so you've got to get your skills a little sharper. Did you go for a second round of training?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I didn't get to go to school, actually, but Coco, Courtney Storer spent a lot of time with me in my kitchen and she's just the best. Mostly, we focused on making stocks and fileting fish. There was a lot branzino fileting, a lot of branzino fileting. She's the best. I love her. She is our culinary consultant and Chris Storer's sister and she's phenomenal.
Kerry Diamond:
Courtney's amazing.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Love you, Courtney, Coco.
Kerry Diamond:
She's been on the show a few times.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Love her.
Kerry Diamond:
Would you like to go stage in a fancy kitchen one day?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I did a few days, but I was just allowed to stand wedged between the nook at Contra, which, just recently closed. And I didn't want to. I'm like, "This choreography right here..." Because it's such a tiny little kitchen. I was like this, "I would be a catastrophe and get in the way, so let me just watch it." And I would spend hours each day just watching. They let me clean herbs and that's good. I was good. I was like, you start forks, you got to start. You start where you start. So that's what I did, and I learned so much. I feel that I learned what was equally as important, not as much.
But what was really important was for me to witness the choreography and how they move around each other just instinctually with the slightest in such a small space and watching how food is inspected before and how many folks come in to inspect each section of what is supposed to go on that plate and the servers, these multi-talented servers and their extensive knowledge of everything on that plate, where it came from, the quality of the ingredients, I feel like even though I might disappoint you with my food, it was thrilling for me.
Kerry Diamond:
You told me something about your family earlier that was very funny before we started rolling, that now that you play a cook/chef, people expect you to be a good cook at home. But when you played a doctor and a lawyer, no one was coming to you for medical or legal advice.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah. Now the expectation with family, it's like you can't just... I feel so much guilt ordering a pizza. There's just basic things that I know how to do, now I'm questioning everything. So I made a little roast pork this weekend, a technique that I learned how to make all that fat skin super crispy. That was success, but I skipped the step of fully rinsing off the salt used to dehydrate it. So then the rest of pernil was super, super salty and they were so cute though. They're like, "Oh my God, it's amazing. We love it." So those are the things that now I'm questioning what I thought I knew in my bones, and I'm like, "Look, I've been laid up for months," because I just had a full knee replacement. So with time that I wanted to be able to be practicing and learning, I just couldn't do it. I couldn't stand up. Sorry guys, I'm going to have to experiment on you.
Kerry Diamond:
When do you start filming season three?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
February.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, February. Wow.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
We're still working it out.
Kerry Diamond:
Okay. How exciting. Congratulations.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for having me on here. I just want to say I was really nervous about doing the interview for Cherry Bombe in the Christmas edition, and hey, listen, I'm no expert in anything and I thank you for how generous and kind you helped me present in the article, so thank you.
Kerry Diamond:
Credit goes to Sarah Cristobal, who's our guest editor on the issue. You worked with Sarah on that piece.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Thank you, Sarah. Thank you. Thank you.
Kerry Diamond:
That's a good segue. We're going to talk about the story. Since you are in our holiday issue, I want you to expand on a few of the things we talked about. I loved learning about your family traditions and your Christmases at your grandmother's down at her apartment in Chelsea. Tell us a little bit about what they were. They sounded so warm, but chaotic and packed and beautiful food.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Well, Christmas was a lot of cousins rolling through. She had a railroad apartment, but somehow she had a full size tree. And we didn't have modern Christmas lights. Y'all don't know. There was a thing that looked like a fan and it had different colors attached to it, and it would spin with a light bulb behind. And that's how you had got multicolors, movement in the room of Christmas. And that jumps out at me. We were all obsessed with March of the Wooden Soldiers.
Kerry Diamond:
I read that in your piece. There wasn't a lot to watch. People forget pre streaming and VCRs and all of that.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, and that was such a special gift.
Kerry Diamond:
It was on Channel 11 or something, right?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
Like WPIX, you got what you got.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah. And the commercial with the horse clopping sounds and the jingle bells, I remember it as having just such a rush, man.
Kerry Diamond:
“Miracle on 34th Street.”
Liza Colón-Zayas:
“Miracle on 34th Street.”
Kerry Diamond:
“A Wonderful Life.”
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, it's “A Wonderful Life.” And now I look back at those films with more cynicism, but back then, we didn't-
Kerry Diamond:
Same. Back then, it was great. We didn't know.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
We didn't know. What you don't know, you don't know.
Kerry Diamond:
Was your grandmother really cooking by herself for all the relatives?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yes.
Kerry Diamond:
Wow. She wouldn't let anybody in to help?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No, no. She was a tough cookie. She was a tough cookie. And I think it was like maybe 15 years ago, I was doing a play in Chelsea. It was a two show day, so I wanted to run over there and wish her a happy birthday and run back to do the second show. My family was there, my mom was there, my mom, her mobility was starting to... And so there was a cane and someone tried to hand her the cane and she was like, "Get out of here. I don't use those things." And she was like 89 years old, man. She was cooking, serving. You just stay out of her... You could walk through the kitchen to get to the bedroom at the end, but you weren't lingering or trying to help.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us about her specialties.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Arroz con gandules, which is rice, yellow rice with peas. But I just loved her beans. Like I said, I didn't love food. I didn't love to eat anybody's beans, but grandma's beans, she would make from scratch and she never used any powdered stuff. All the ingredients were fresh and she'd have the motor, the pilón, that's how I remember her with that. And then she would make everything.
Kerry Diamond:
I saw a video of, I forget what you were making, were you maybe making a sofrito and you smelled it and your whole face lit up?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah. And you know why else it lit up was because I used the sweet peppers and didn't realize there were some hot peppers. And we don't use jalapenos, really, in the Caribbean, at least when I was coming up, that's Mexican. And so they looked similar so I chopped them. It was good, but it was extra. So that also explained... It was a great fun time doing that.
Kerry Diamond:
You also wrote beautifully about Christmas in Puerto Rico. Did you go as a child?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I never went to Christmas in Puerto Rico as a child. I am going over the next few days because we celebrate Christmas for at least two months. It's the longest Christmas in the world. It's just the decorations are everywhere. The parties in the streets are epic, the parades, the hospitality. Everyone's inviting you over for food and you don't just come over for food, but people come over with instruments and parodiando. You just come and singing these traditional folk songs. It's just a party, but an all-inclusive of all ages kind of party. I don't know. But the warmth of the people, the welcoming, it's beautiful.
Kerry Diamond:
You also wrote about Coquitos.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Coquito.
Kerry Diamond:
Coquito is having a moment. It's even on the cover of Bon Appétit right now.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Oh, yes.
Kerry Diamond:
I don't know if you saw that.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No, I didn't.
Kerry Diamond:
Tell us the ingredients and why you think it's so popular today.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
It depends on how much time and effort you have. Some people make them where they purchase all the coconuts and crack them and blend them and boil them and run it through the sieve and cook it down with the vanilla and the la, la, la. I just do it from the can. Listen, there's the sweetened and condensed milk, the evaporated milk, and I love a ton of Bacardi because there's so much sugar in those other ingredients. So I'm like, "Unless there's real heat, I don't need the extra sugar." I just get grouchy. Yeah, the cinnamon and nutmeg and this and the vanilla. So everybody has their own. Some people add raw eggs, some people don't. Everybody has their own variation and claims that they're the masters. It's delicious. I'm sorry, eggnog, I'm sorry. And you want it. I was getting to a point where I would make big batches of it and then, oh, I got so much extra though, and I'm having a nightcap and then it's creamer for the coffee the next day.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, that's a fun-
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, okay. I'm thinking my family's Irish coffee.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yeah, no honey.
Kerry Diamond:
That's a fun variation on that. Okay. And we have a really nice Coquito recipe in the issue from Toni Tipton-Martin who's amazing.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Yes, I saw it. It's in the page after.
Kerry Diamond:
So if you have that issue, check it out. What do you think Tina does for the holidays?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I think she spends it with her neighborhood, with maybe the doña upstairs.
Kerry Diamond:
Does she cook or does she get a break?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
I think she cooks and I think she keeps it just with the one or two other orphans in the building.
Kerry Diamond:
All right. We usually do a speed round. I'm going to spare you the speed round since we went over a little bit. Do you have a favorite holiday song?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
No, there's too many. I love the old stuff, so I can't... Hark the Herald Angels, the Peanuts. I listen still to the Peanuts Vince Guaraldi album.
Kerry Diamond:
Oh, it's a beautiful one. Okay, so I'll ask you our last question. We always ask everybody this. If you had to be trapped on a desert island with one food celebrity, who would it be and why?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
It'd have to be, if I can... I'm sorry. It's my fantasy, so I'm going to say it would have to be Anthony Bourdain.
Kerry Diamond:
Why Anthony?
Liza Colón-Zayas:
He was such a badass, rock star, humanitarian, funny.
Kerry Diamond:
Yeah, I think he's our number one answer.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Absolutely.
Kerry Diamond:
For a good reason. Well, Liza, honestly, you made my year.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Oh, man.
Kerry Diamond:
“The Bear” is so important to me and so important to our community.
Liza Colón-Zayas:
Thank you. You made my 2023 also, gracias.
Kerry Diamond:
That's it for today's show. If you love “The Bear,” be sure to check out our past interviews with the show's culinary producer Courtney Storer and star Jeremy Allen White. Our theme song is by the band Tralala. Joseph Hazan is the studio engineer for Newsstand Studios. Our producer is Catherine Baker. Our associate producer is Jenna Sadhu, and our editorial assistant is Londyn Crenshaw. Thanks for listening, everybody. You're the Bombe.